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Date: 5/3/2004 10:30:00 AM ( SD-Admin ) I love and miss you dear! So much has happened! I need to call you soon! WOW! We need to catch up on things! How is your mom? Was the trip good? Inquiring minds want to know! |
Date: 5/3/2004 10:44:00 AM From Authorid: 2030 I'm educated enough to know that the alternative to the current administration is not the answer. A kinder hugglie dictatorship is still a dictatorship. I doubt even you can say that Bush and Co. are so all powerfull and super intelligent that they have completely controlled America in just over 3 years (and half of that with a Democratic controlled Senate). With Democrats in the White House for 8 years previously you'd think we would have a utopia. Educate yourself indeed, strength, security, capitalism, involvement. Beyond that I'll just say nice cut and paste. |
Date: 5/3/2004 11:22:00 AM ( From Author ) From Authorid: 24924 Geez, oh great bushie-lover-and-supporter, BCAR, thank you ever so much for adding the REDUNDANT "cut and paste" remark. I can see that in the beginning of the post, that stating it was by Dan Berman, and providing the link was not enough for you. Umm...I've never seen YOU say: "Nice cut and paste" IF your buddies copy and paste something that SUPPORTS your views, or YOUR favorite prez. Go look up the word: hypocrite, 'twould be my advice. NOW.....no one is saying anything about any "kinder hugglie dictatorship". No one is saying that the previous 8 years was any "utopia". READ THE ENTIRE ARTICLE, BCAR. Your blind alleigence to your fellow red-neck Texan, Bush, Jr, is showing here, nothing more. |
Date: 5/3/2004 11:25:00 AM ( From Author ) From Authorid: 24924 Author Only, I love and miss you too! Yeah, I totally agree on the "so much has happened". BOTH sides....*sigh* and we will talk soon. We have a lot of catching up to do, indeed. Thanks! |
Date: 5/3/2004 11:26:00 AM From Authorid: 2030 I read the entire article catherine and once again I see any comment I make to one of your posts brings on a rant. You make my point better than I ever could. Please continue. |
Date: 5/3/2004 11:30:00 AM ( From Author ) From Authorid: 24924 BCAR, Your replies to my posts have always MOSTLY been slams, slurs, digs, jabs and outright lies.....and most always are deleted. Just because this site, and SOME of us won't allow you to do such things, you go around to every other site and knock, slander, and slam. Hey, it works for your like-minded buddies, but it ain't working here. If you want to offer something here, with regards to THIS topic, and THIS topic only, please do so, but any of your personal cheap shots at me will be deleted. |
Date: 5/3/2004 11:37:00 AM From Authorid: 2030 I agree that we need to educate ourselves but I disagree with the slant the author of the cut and paste story takes. Here in a public forum posted in discussion I made a comment. All slams digs and other accusations were made by someone other than myself. |
Date: 5/3/2004 11:41:00 AM From Authorid: 61977 Great Post. Well said...I could not agree with you more as far as the government is concerned. We all must take a deeper look at things. HUGS, |
Date: 5/3/2004 11:58:00 AM From Authorid: 42940 This was most excellent and I agree with every word. *** bad kitty *** |
Date: 5/3/2004 12:26:00 PM From Authorid: 62506 Anyone who wants to see Bush out of office is a friend of mine.For those who think he is doing a good job in office,I find them delusional.Bush is for the oil industry...period.I have 3 business...none of them oil related.All three have suffered under his administration.To me this is the measure of his merit.His foreign policy is motivated by oil,his domestic policy is motivated by oil.His family is an oil family.His Vice President is an oilman. If you put a barrel of oil and a newborn baby in the middle of the hiway and Bush had to choose which one to hit with his Caddy...I have no doubt which one would be ran over.He'd probably have that idiotic smirk on his face afterwards too. |
Date: 5/3/2004 12:30:00 PM From Authorid: 2030 You really don't think he'd swerve or at least try to stradle the baby with the tires? |
Date: 5/3/2004 1:10:00 PM From Authorid: 62506 I actually think he'd accelerate! JK! It was a hypothetical situation. I'm sure in real life,Bush would just blow the little begger off the face of the planet with an air strike! LMAO! BCAR....ok maybe you're not delusional...just zealous! |
Date: 5/3/2004 1:21:00 PM From Authorid: 2030 A zealous anti Democrat looking for a viable alternative. Nader's looking better all the time. |
Date: 5/3/2004 6:20:00 PM From Authorid: 62367 I used your link and read the complete article. I'll say that much of his agrument was way oversimplified. He evidently has the idea that every intervention or military action this country has made since the Spanish American War (1898) was an act of imperialism or an inhumane action. Few actions have only one motivation. Many of the wars and interventions of the US military center around the strategic interests of the US. Most other countries also look after their particular strategic interests. That goes for France's stance against the war in Iraq. They were defending their monitary and petrol interests by hoping to keep Saddam in power. The stance had little to do with moral superiority. When you get into foreign relations, morality and national interest have to go hand in hand. Mr. Berman is right to be against the war and to fear for American liberties. I am more frightened by what I observe within this nation than what I see overseas. Mr. Bush's announced policy of premptive war against nations before they can come after us is a horrendous idea and will come back to haunt us. |
Date: 5/4/2004 8:36:00 AM
From Authorid: 36967
You are entitled to your opponion, but either you fight this ragime over in the Middle East, or we will fight them in our land like New York. If you protest this war, you are asking for another September 11th. That is the way I see it. |
Date: 5/4/2004 11:39:00 PM From Authorid: 37900 Mr. Berman does not feel strongly enough about the "unprovoked invasion." Allow me to extend his ideas logically. If the "invasion" of Iraq was wrong, then we should leave. If we should leave, then we should return Saddam to power and offer him huge sums of money for the inconvenience we caused him. I note with some concern that Mr. Berman does not go that far. Could it be that he is also afflicted with "sheep mentality"? Ideas have consequences, Mr. Berman. Should Saddam be restored to power? Mr. Berman seems to know the quotes that others are using, including the trite phraseology that the war was about oil. Had he taken the time to follow his own admonition for self-education, he would have discovered that the United States survived just fine without Iraqi oil for a number of years, and that if we were interested in a country's oil, it would have been far better and cheaper to invade Mexico. Furthermore, Mr. Berman is oblivious to the thought-processes of radical Islamic fundamentalists, who hate America not for what she's done, but for what she is. Mr. Berman, apparently true to his sources of inspiration, surmises that the only way to avoid future terrorist attacks is to withdraw from every country that might have radical Muslims, lest we offend them further. Mr. Berman, why don't you say what you really mean? September 11th was America's fault; every president from Carter to Bush 2 is to blame for the 3,000 tragic deaths because they followed policies that angered Muslim extremists. Why, the United States should yield its sovereignty to the United Nations, an organization that knows quite a bit about solving world problems. Stay strong, Mr. Berman, perhaps in 180 days your candidate will be elected. |
Date: 5/5/2004 12:10:00 AM
From Authorid: 12341
Nation-building requires an overriding desire for power and control over others, and the nicer among us just don't possess that trait. So it's the world' pigs who end up governing the rest of us. And I believe it applies not just to governments, but any large institutions, including corporations and churches. I think that pretty well sums up human history. So, you are probably asking, who cares? All politicians lie, we all know that, so tell us something new. Well, I wanted to provide a backdrop, paint a picture for you, that will explain my melancholy in writing this particular piece. I am listlessly plunking at the keys to report back about my Internet journeys. Here is some of what I found: In 1963 an American Military Program named "Operation Northwoods" was concocted whereby we could stir up American support for an invasion of Cuba. The plan called for U.S. agents to fake terrorist campaigns which included bombings, hijackings, plane crashes and dead Americans. (Anyone remember all those hijacked planes around 30 years ago? And how the demanded destination was invariably Cuba?) Cuba before Castro was a Mafia/corporate fiefdom. President Kennedy rejected "Operation Northwoods" just a few months before he was killed. However, according to a classified document, Rumsfeld has resuscitated that plan under a new name: "Proactive Preemptive Operations Group" (P2OG). Costing $100 million a year, CIA agents are to target terrorist leaders in order to provoke terrorist attacks against Americans, thereby justifying "counter-attacks" and the spoils of war that go with it. Sound impossible? Enter Lt. General William G. "Jerry" Boykin, 13-year veteran of the Army's top-secret Delta Force. The Pentagon recently assigned him the task of tracking down high-profile Muslim terrorists. He is now the new deputy undersecretary of Defense for intelligence. Just one problem. As a fervent Evangelical Christian he views this war on terrorism as a clash between Judeo Christian values and……….Satan. He equated the Muslim world with Satan. Discussing his battle against a Muslim warlord in Somalia, Boykin said, "I knew my God was bigger than his. I knew that my God was a real God and his was an idol." Way to go, Boykin. That won't piss off Muslims more than they already are, will it? Nah! Call Allah an idol. What the hell. Boykin also said that he was part of the "army of God" and that Bush was in the White House "because God put him there." Wrong, Boykin. Jeb Bush and the Republican hand-picked Supreme Court did. By the way, that's something else that was swept under the carpet during the election fiasco of 2000 - the U.S. Constitution. The 12th Amendment clearly states: "The person having the greatest number of votes for President, shall be the President, if such number be a majority of the whole number of Electors appointed; and if no person have such majority, then from the persons having the highest numbers not exceeding three on the list of those voted for as President, the House of Representatives shall choose immediately, by ballot, the President." What could be more clear? The House of Representatives, not the Supreme Court, is to deal with disputed elections. But let's not quibble. The Bill of Rights is being tossed out the window as we speak, so I guess we should just shut up about such trivialities. Shortly after his incredibly incendiary remarks, Boykin's "apology" included the unbelievable comment that what he meant by idol was not Allah but the Muslim warlord's "worship of money and power; idolatry." Oh, puh-leeze! His actual words again: "I knew my God was bigger than his." His what, Boykin? His God, that's what. "I knew that my God was a real God and his was an idol." His what was an idol? His God, Allah, that's what. Looks like Rummy's plan to "provoke terrorist attacks against Americans" is right on track. And in July when Tommy Franks was departing Iraq for good, to retire, he repeated Bush's earlier provocative remark about Iraqi militants attacking U.S. troops: "Bring 'em on!" Brilliant. Our people are dying over there, and these clowns are acting as though they like it. Bring 'em on! Put up your dukes! Why not just pelt them with pork chops? The resulting (justified) anger of Muslim communities everywhere would be the same. Throughout Iraq the atmosphere is that of a turf war between rival gangs, and the U.S. body bags keep coming home as a result. Yes, P2OG is going as planned. The recent chaos and horrific violence involving 9/11 and the War in Iraq are the result of over 30 years' of American planning, interrupted only by the Clinton Administration. (And look what happened to him.) On August 2, 1990 President Bush called a press conference. He explained that the threat of global war had significantly receded, but an unforeseen threat to national security could come from any angle and from any power. Iraq, by a remarkable coincidence, invaded Northern Kuwait later the same day. Remember Afghanistan and the Taliban? And how we were going to bring freedom and democracy to that country? Well, they still have no new constitution, no new laws and little food. The Warlords rule. Private armies of an estimated 700,000 people roam Afghanistan continuing a traditional system of fiefdoms. A UNICEF project officer stated, "We felt safer under the Taliban." 90% of Afghani children are not in school. Little has changed for the average Afghani woman. Many women have yet to stop wearing the burqa due to fear of persecution and the new Interior Ministry still requires women to receive permission from their male relatives before they travel. How many times did we all watch the documentary, "Beneath the Veil" and think all that would change for those poor women? Well, it didn't. We just didn't care. And still don't. The 2003 invasion of Iraq was planned before W. Bush was even president. Global Domination, and nothing less, was and is the motivation behind America's foreign policy decisions. When looters devastated Baghdad, only the Ministry of Oil was unscathed, since U.S. marines protected it. Since then, handpicked Iraqi officials have been installed and there is a move toward privatization of Iraq's oil industry. Since the first Gulf War, the U.S. has built a network of military bases that now almost completely encircle the oil fields of the Persian Gulf. But Iraq's oil in and of itself was not the motivation for invading Iraq. We are after larger things - namely, the whole planet. Example: The April 11, 2002 military coup in Venezuela was supported by the United States government. Since his 1998 election, President Hugo Chavez has increasingly socialized the Venezuelan government. One of his most controversial moves was to nationalize Venezuela's oil company PDVSA. Venezuela is the fourth largest oil-producing nation, and the third largest oil provider to the U.S. As the leader of OPEC, Chavez has encouraged lowering oil production to raise prices. Though Chavez survived the coup attempt, the USA was nevertheless in favor of the coup. In November 2000, Iraq became the first OPEC nation to begin selling its oil for Euros. Since then, the value of the Euro has increased 17%, and the dollar has begun to decline. One important reason for the invasion and installation of a U.S. dominated government in Iraq was to force the country back to the dollar. Another reason for the invasion was to dissuade further OPEC momentum toward the Euro, especially from Iran - the second largest OPEC producer, who was actively discussing a switch to Euros for its oil exports. While W. Bush screamed about the lack of accountability that Iraq was showing, and he publicly accused them of intentionally falsifying weapons declarations documents to present to the UN, the truth is that we, the good old United States, had removed over 8,000 pages of the 11,800 page original report. Those missing pages implicated many U.S. companies that had illegally supplied Saddam Hussein with WMD and the training to use them. Implicated were: Eastman Kodak, Dupont, Honeywell, Rockwell, Sperry, Hewlett-Packard, and Bechtel. Also included were U.S. government agencies such as the Department of Energy, Department of Agriculture and Department of Defense, and nuclear weapons labs such as Lawrence-Livermore, Los Alamos and Sandia. But Europe didn't buy our story since Iraq had made copies of the complete original report and sent them to European countries, which is why Europe was so opposed to our invasion. |
Date: 5/5/2004 6:21:00 AM ( From Author ) From Authorid: 24924 Alfrowi, your reply is so far out there; so utterly "pass the buck", blame blame blame the other guy, so typical point the fingerish, that I simply had to read it three times, and stare at your name tag and tell myself I wasn't seeing things, that it really WAS you who posted that. I am really SHOCKED. I'll stop right there though, and not get into any specifics of it all ....at least until I've had a chance to calm down. Thank you for your response anyway. Any and all replies are MUCH appreciated here, no matter how much any of us may differ in our views. |
Date: 5/5/2004 7:21:00 AM ( From Author ) From Authorid: 24924 Thank you, Brenda. Your reply reminds me of something said by a director (a grandson of Ghandi) of one of the Ghandi Institutes: "I think we today have submitted to MIGHT as being right, and we condone violence and wars fought in our name. It is time we awoke the conscience of the world to the fact that RIGHT is always mightier". The United States is seen as the only superpower left in the world? NOT true. There are TWO superpowers. The OTHER is the millions and millions of people armed not with guns but with the power of nonviolent resistence. Ghandi had a word for it "satyagraha". It literally means: TRUTH FORCE, a physical demonstration of an injustice that confronts the oppressors with the intolerable effects of their policies. "Do not bring your opponents to their knees.....Bring them to their SENSES", he once said. |
Date: 5/5/2004 8:06:00 AM ( From Author ) From Authorid: 24924 http://www.unsolvedmysteries.com/usm381031.html |
Date: 5/5/2004 2:43:00 PM From Authorid: 61977 Brenda your comment is so RIGHT on....SCARY yet FACTUAL. HUGS, |
Date: 5/5/2004 4:44:00 PM ( From Author ) From Authorid: 24924 I'm sick of all these people of the Bush Administration blaming past administrations, blaming, finferpointing, accusing ; anything to get the heat off and away from them. I bet there is a whole dossier somewhere on file blaming Clinton's cat , SOCKS for something or other. Dubya has even jumped on the ole ABB Bandwagon himself. ABB (anybody but Bush). I do hope That Sept. 11 commission gets down to the nitty-gritty and uncovers the TRUTH but it probably is nothing but pure politics too where truth will just get in the way of a good sound bite. |
Date: 5/5/2004 11:51:00 PM From Authorid: 37900 Thanks for your response and your tolerance, Thinker. First, I don't see the evidence that this is a war about oil, despite the excessive verbiage. There simply are easier nations to invade if we wanted oil. Second, the logical extension of the idea that this is an immoral war is that Saddam should be returned to power. Strangely, I have yet to hear one critic of the war follow his or her argument to a rational conclusion. Third, to state that the administration knew of September 11 before it happened is equivalent to charging the President with 3,000 second-degree murders. Again, no one making the audacious first claim seems willing to logically extend the idea. Fourth, Mr. Berman's criticism of the war in Iraq without a suitable means of addressing the reality of radical terrorists is an indication that he is not seeking the truth; he is seeking President Kerry. |
Date: 8/19/2004 2:07:00 PM ( Admin-DNL ) Excellant post... |
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