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Date: 4/30/2003 6:16:00 PM
From Authorid: 58334
I feel I have my own religion. I have my certain beliefs and thats enough for me ~nimiwae~  |
Date: 4/30/2003 7:06:00 PM
From Authorid: 13897
No. Beliefs do NOT equal religion. religion is based on being submissive and not thinking for yourself. you know how many WARS and DEATHS are the cause of religion? think about that.  |
Date: 4/30/2003 7:15:00 PM
From Authorid: 24924
"Impossible not to have beliefs"? NOT true. I have many many beliefs, but NONE of them have anything to do with revealed religion and or a god. "those who have no religion, must have a religion"? "MUST"??? I realize this is an extremely hard concept for you to grasp and understand, but millions of people don't have any religious or god beliefs. Also, not everyone who prays has others concerns in mind. I don't pray, but I have a great concern for others and their lives here on Earth. Appears to me, that you are just another misguided individual who THINKS that one has no life; and can't have love, compassion or concern for their fellow human beings......IF, they don't have a god belief. THAT is totally skewed thinking, m'dere.  |
Date: 4/30/2003 7:20:00 PM
From Authorid: 28767
Ok so if a person grew up and had no knowledge of God or Jesus, or anything else in particular? Than does that mean he has a religion. Do we learn religion cause were taught thus we grasp the concept of god and a spiritual world, or would this person who never had knowledge of any God or Jesus even think of a spirit or that theres an afterlife? Peace Out..  |
Date: 4/30/2003 7:33:00 PM
From Authorid: 14780
I do personally know a man that does not have a "religion". He is a kind hearted man and we joke around all the time. He will tell you flat out he does not believe.  |
Date: 4/30/2003 8:32:00 PM
From Authorid: 15070
"religion" was created by man- neing "spiritual" means having a relationship with a Creator, or Creators. ~JMO~  |
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Date: 4/30/2003 8:33:00 PM
From Authorid: 15070
I mean "being" spiritual |
Date: 4/30/2003 9:41:00 PM
From Authorid: 53836
hehe, I was gonna say you opened a mighty big can of worms here...religions fall under the belief of God, ex. Baptist, Methodist, Lutheran, Catholic, Christian...to fall under the religion catagory, I think you have to believe in God...but I know everyone believes in something...I believe in myself, and bet others believe in themselves as well, but that certainly has nothing to with religion   |
Date: 4/30/2003 11:29:00 PM
From Authorid: 55967
Scientists have recently discovered that our brains are naturally wired for spiritual experience and a contemplation of God. We are definitely created to worship. An old argument that atheists once had was that people are born with animalistic minds in that we have no awareness of anything greater than ourselves and thus had to be taught religion. We know now that that is not true. ~GypsyHawk~  |
Date: 4/30/2003 11:33:00 PM
From Authorid: 11240
Well, I think you're just arguing semantics (the meaning of words). I think that most people take the word "religion" in the connotation of a "belief system". With the word "system" being the operative one in that definition, religion takes on the added element of "an order, a plan". I personally didn't follow an orderly route in coming to my beliefs and there is nothing systmatic about them. I prefer to not look to my religion so much as a belief system but as a worship system. God Bless.  |
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Date: 4/30/2003 11:33:00 PM
From Authorid: 11240
Well, I think you're just arguing semantics (the meaning of words). I think that most people take the word "religion" in the connotation of a "belief system". With the word "system" being the operative one in that definition, religion takes on the added element of "an order, a plan". I personally didn't follow an orderly route in coming to my beliefs and there is nothing systmatic about them. I prefer to not look to my religion so much as a belief system but as a worship system. God Bless. |
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Date: 5/1/2003 5:35:00 AM
From Authorid: 24924
Gypsyhawk, We are not born with a God belief. Theism IS learned. Children's minds are like a blank canvas at birth; totally dependent upon parents for EVERYTHING. They're like little sponges, soaking up every thing that they see and hear. They TRUST big people; grown-ups, and believe that what they are being told is the truth. Many are taught the little comfort stories in sunday school, those little stories fabricated by ignorant ancients to explain the things they couldn't understand. Children amulate that which they see their parents say and do; and are taught bigotry, which is inherent in Christianity; that exclusivistic and bigoted compulsion to reject anyone who is not christian and go forth and "set them straight". There is a Indian quote that says: "The World came first, and the Gods came later". |
Date: 5/1/2003 7:36:00 AM
From Authorid: 61104
My hubby is a nonbeleiver of many things he is not sure what he beleives but he is sure of what he does not beleive. I have beleifs. I beleive in something that is very special to me and may not be to others and tend to feel passionately about them to the point where some people beleive I get hostile and maybe I do but that is because I beleive so strongly.  |
Date: 5/1/2003 8:36:00 AM
From Authorid: 54532
I am not an athiest and i do believe there is someone up there. But i am not like a Holy roller so i think that beliefs are not religions.  |
Date: 5/1/2003 9:27:00 AM
From Authorid: 16671
I beleive in something that is very special to me and may not be to others and tend to feel passionately about them to the point where some people beleive I get hostile and maybe I do but that is because I beleive so strongly. I"LL SECOND that.  |
Date: 5/1/2003 2:07:00 PM
From Authorid: 24845
I think so, I think that those that believe in something do have a religion.  |
Date: 5/1/2003 3:42:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 56927
Beliefs. I love them you love them, Everybody has them. All people. Many. Loads, honest. Be they religious, or be they non religious beliefs. WE ALL HAVE BELIEFS. Many of us have them. ALL BELIEFS ARE RELIGIOuS. It matters not what they are. I beleive in crisps, therefore its sort of religious. In a way. Sort of. Maybe, I don't know. Perhaps I'm wrong. The point is. Beliefs are fantastic. Facntastic they are. If I believe there is no Rod Steward, thats just my belief. Its cool to have beliefs. They orientate, and you can't blame them. Thats because... I don't know why. Probably because they're so cool. I belive in God. No I don't. I vcan't work out whether he's real or not. pErhaps its psychological. I don't know, not sure. Lets figure it out. Work it out sorry. Er. Beliefs though, we need them. You can't not have a belief. Its imposible. Can't be true. Ridiculo. oh! Look. Its why we can never abolish religion. Because its our beliefs, which face us in the right direction. If we abolished beliefs, we be chocolate chip cookies doing a show because the ancient mesopatamians probably wanted the spaniels to grab t-junctions in Rome. I have a point.  |
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Date: 5/1/2003 4:59:00 PM
From Authorid: 24924
Helpful Bill, you seem really confused. You don't seem to understand what you are talking about; and are rambling all over the place. Did YOU......even READ.....MY initial response?? What? Are you all there? What makes someone equate ALL beliefs to RELIGION?????? Do you know what the definition of RELIGION really is? Any idea? Religion is defined as pertaining to BELIEF IN the SUPERNATURAL; A GOD or Goddess; a belief in a realm said to be somehow "above" or "beyond" the NATURAL Universe. AGAIN.....I will remind you that many millions of people LACK any supernatural beliefs.....LACK any beliefs in gods or ghosts or revealed anything. And MY beliefs certainly do NOT in anyway, shape, form, or fashion....constitute a definition as a "RELIGION", thank you very much! sheesh...how could anyone....any sane person, equate a NON-BELIEF in gods or religion....as BEING a religion!?? Can we all say: ABSURD?? |
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Date: 5/1/2003 6:10:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 56927
Thinker, thinker, thinker. Thinker, what on earth are you talking?? Now seriously, everyone has beliefs. If I believe Rod Stewart is excellent, its just what I believe. But nobody really likes Rod Stewart on account of his little wiggle, not to mention his sparkly trousers.. However. My point is this. We need beliefs. Beliefs orientate. They direct us. If we have belief, which we seem to do, then in that case, lets see. Oh dear, we might have a conundrum on our hands. It seems to be that people with beliefs, are discipline. Its so weird, but sure. People with beliefs are in no way whatsoever fools, for they, you see, Its seemingly... to say the least... so seemingly, Thinker. So very seemingly. We can argue for hours about beliefs. I have them. you have them. And I suppose they would have a connection with well being. A religion has strict rules, or rules at least, which have in actual fact to be followed at least accordingly so as to advance. With out beliefs, we would be lost. Otherwise, not. The problem is. if I believe.. ahh I don't know. You win... Congrats! Its fun, I swear. I bit cheeky.. Beliefs though. |
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Date: 5/1/2003 6:23:00 PM
From Authorid: 24924
Yooohooo! It is: WHAT are YOU....talking about?? You don't read! I SAID: I have beliefs.....I have beliefs......IN MANY THINGS, but they are NOT......RELIGIOUS! Belief in or non belief in Rod Stewart....has NOTHING to do with religion. Got it now? |
Date: 5/1/2003 6:31:00 PM
From Authorid: 53052
alot of people intermix beliefs and morals... you can have high morals and no religion.... i personally follow no religion  |
Date: 5/1/2003 6:53:00 PM
From Authorid: 22080
atheism is a religon, religon no matter what is a beleif that someone has, believing paper is god could be your belief which would be your religon  |
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Date: 5/1/2003 6:58:00 PM
From Authorid: 24924
Jestr, atheism is...LACK OF religion; LACK of theism; LACK of.....LACK of. ANTI-theism; anti-religion; anti-god.....GET IT? |
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Date: 5/1/2003 7:07:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 56927
I understand, Thinker. But if thats the case then we are in the same boat,. It has everything to do with it. But I say all beliefs are religious. Its just the case if we have to get this thing off the ground. Any set of beliefs is religious. Anything religious is in the interest of advancing the human race. Everyone has beliefs, whether they are known to be in the in the interest of God, then that is the thing. I disagree with midnightly, I think you can not have no religion. Its not possible. I'm not religios is a preposterous thing to say. If you aren't part of a mainstream religion, then it is more subtle, such as consumerism Consumerism is a sort of religion. |
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Date: 5/1/2003 7:15:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 56927
If you have no religion, what you find is that yu are part of a culture who suubconsiouly worships material objects, possessions, or values items, life, superficially. To worship money soley, is to worship a love of the self, in my opinion. To care about others is to care about what we know as the objective God. |
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Date: 5/1/2003 7:19:00 PM
From Authorid: 24924
I feel sorry for you, Helpful Bob; I really do. You have extremely SET ways/views of things you do not understand and don't want to accept. "THEISM" is defined as the "belief in a God or gods". The prefix "A" means "without", so the term "A-theism" literally means "without theism". One who does not believe in the existence of a god or supernatural being is properly designated as an atheist. We do not believe in gods; worship of those gods; we do not believe in prayer; nor organized churches; no do we believe in the bible, or any creeds and dogmas that come with belief in Christianity. "Impossible" you say?? BELIEVE IT, honey, believe it. Don't go trying to tell NON-believers how WE feel or how and what we believe, please. It just makes you look extremely ignorant. |
Date: 5/1/2003 7:21:00 PM
From Authorid: 22080
atheism : a disbelief in the existence of deity b : the doctrine that there is no deity religon  a)a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices,(b) cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith |
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Date: 5/1/2003 7:24:00 PM
From Authorid: 24924
I "worship" NOTHING! Go to my story and read exactly WHAT and HOW, and WHY....I believe the way I do. LEARN....something different than that which you've always been told, the lies, of the christian religion, Helpful Bob. Please go to: http://www.unsolvedmysteries.com/usm261079.html |
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Date: 5/1/2003 7:44:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 56927
If you have no religion, what you find is that yu are part of a culture who suubconsiouly worships material objects, possessions, or values items, life, superficially. To worship money soley, is to worship a love of the self, in my opinion. To care about others is to care about what we know as the objective God. |
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Date: 5/1/2003 8:04:00 PM
From Authorid: 24924
Jestr, for thousands of years; the term: atheism has very negative connotations to the masses; especially the religious saturated and ignorant minds. We carry thousands of years of bigotry at the hands of theists; and checking several dictionary definitions, most give only a partial definition and or add on too much definition that is NOT true(such a the one you cited); and one dictionary even equated atheism with wickedness!! Good gawd! what a mislead; misread, and ignorant world the masses of believers reside in. IF my belief in TRUTH; and humanity and the power of the human mind, if my self reliance and integrity, and pursuit of TRUTH, and EDUCATION; if by my not relying on superstion and a mythical "god", and refusing to bow down to dogma and hypocrisy, etc, if this means that I am "wicked" or "eviL"....then I wish to forever remain "EVIL". Jestr, your definition is WRONG. Helpful Bob, I'm tossing in the towel on you. One cannot communicate with a mind that has slammed the door on reason and common sense, and nailed it shut. |
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Date: 5/1/2003 8:13:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 56927
I agree, Thinker, generally speaking, you do have set ways and views. Its just human life. I can't see where you think my ignorance comes into it.... Thinker!! For goodness sake, It doesn't matter how much you shout and scream at me. I know my beliefs, and i can't see how having a belief in God is ignorant! |
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Date: 5/1/2003 9:27:00 PM
From Authorid: 22080
ok your right but if you look at religon your belief is there is no god a theists belief is there is one, what make it a religon? BELIEFS |
Date: 5/1/2003 10:36:00 PM
From Authorid: 37872
I can't BELIEVE this is even a debate. Equating belief to religion is fine IF you're religious, heck, it may even make sense to you; but for the rest of the world of humans that have other than religious beliefs, this theory is absurd. Plus, I believe that you never proved why WE need religion or even offered a good theory. I'm pretty certain and honestly BELIEVE, without going into extreme detail, that a system of beliefs can exist in a world without religion. Beliefs are a product of human consciousness, religion is a product of human consciousness; human consciousness is not a product of religion. Beliefs,in general, are not a product of religion. Religious beliefs, maybe, came from religion, but even that is questionable. Seems to me that religious beliefs came before the actual act of religion, thus beliefs existed prior to religion.... Not to mention, beliefs are in the realm of thought, whereas religion is in the realm of action. There is plenty of proof that shows that thought precedes action and can exist independently of action... thus beliefs are independent of religion.  |
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Date: 5/1/2003 10:40:00 PM
From Authorid: 11240
Bill, I find you very helpful. And funny. Oh and I have pretty good "in"sight so I am with you all the way: I SEE "belief" in disbelief. God Bless. |
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Date: 5/1/2003 11:41:00 PM
From Authorid: 53052
i think your mixing things up... religion is different from culture what is different from morals.. check the dictionary they are different things |
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Date: 5/2/2003 5:12:00 AM
From Authorid: 24924
Raxaos, The believers in christianity WILL never ever learn anything; never accept anything, that doesn't jive with their own little world built up in THEIR MINDS. Ah.....but they will turn around and proclaim how "close minded" we are. They will tell people they don't even know, and have no clue about, that they "worship" money & self , or are "materialistic", tell people what OTHERS believe when they have no clue and don't want to know what they DO believe. Hypocrites, hypocrites, and hypocrites.....never ever disagree with fellow christians on anything, no matter how wrong or bigoted, just as long as it supports THEIR own skewed thinking/belief. Trying to reason and communicate the truth to them is akin to banging your head on the wall, if it doesn't agree with THEIR faith. Yeah....they close up the door and nail it shut on education, for education would void such "freak ball nonsense" that religion IS. |
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Date: 5/2/2003 9:52:00 AM
From Authorid: 11240
Thinker, it's not in our minds (spirits), it's in our hearts (souls). And I disagree plenty with fellow Christians. What I believe is that we should all acknowledge the TRUTH, and the truth is you have mistakenly addressed this author, and in my MORAL fortitude that calls for a correction, if for only the matter of common courtesy. God Bless. |
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Date: 5/2/2003 10:36:00 AM
From Authorid: 24924
"mistakenly addressed"?? I only expressed MY opinion, as a nonbeliever; which HE, and YOU, refuse to accept as the way **I** believe. He then proceeds to tell ME....what and how ***I** believe, when he does not know me. YOU both assume that all beliefs are religious and THAT is NOT true. Now, if there is any "correction" to be made, it will not come from this camp; as I also KNOW what the truth is. It is laughable, Deb, that YOU of all people can speak of "courtesy". Your idea of "courtesy" is to have your say (no matter how wrong or insulting) but mask it with certain "nice" sounding words and ending with a "God bless" or "Peace". *wink* And, I believe we went over the "Heart" "Soul" thingy as opposed to the MIND....before on another post. You didn't believe any of that either. Nope, didn't learn a thing. |
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Date: 5/2/2003 11:31:00 AM
From Authorid: 11240
Uh, Thinker, I was referring to you calling him Bob. God Bless. |
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Date: 5/2/2003 1:08:00 PM
From Authorid: 24924
Well blow me down....just shoot me now....throw me in a dungeon, Deb. I surely made a horrible mistake, saying Helpful Bob instead of Helpful Bill. Whatever shall I do? That little faux pas surely is more important than anything else that has been said here. Forgive me, BILL. I'll try very hard to not ever do that again. |
Date: 5/2/2003 6:56:00 PM
From Authorid: 27046
How many wars have been fought where religion wasn't an issue, it doesn't have to be the main issue, but as some part of an issue?  |
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Date: 5/2/2003 7:25:00 PM
From Authorid: 55967
Probably most of them, Azairyia. ~GypsyHawk~ |
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Date: 5/2/2003 11:52:00 PM
From Authorid: 37872
You're absolutely right, Thinker....right as right can be. |
Date: 5/4/2003 10:44:00 AM
From Authorid: 58030
well i haven't had time to read all these responsis cus a lot of em are just repeats, but i just thing religions is kind of a wrong term for it, EVERYONE has strong beliefs, religion is a strong belief, but all strong beliefs are not a religion, like all protestants are christians, but not all christians are protestants, or all wiccans are witches, but not all witches are wiccans ya know? but I get where your coming from, aethism is kind of a religion but not really, every single person believes in something, you have to have some kind of explanation (i.e. strong belief) for everything, even things where u don't need one it's human nature, but it's just not religion by name, if none of this makes sense tell me i'll try to put it into something that makes more sense i think i was kind of rambling a little  |
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Date: 5/5/2003 9:39:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 56927
My beliefs are intrinsic to how I run my life. Sometimes they'll be lax. strictly religios people have a strict moral code. I belive my legs work perfectly. If I didn't believe it, I'd never be able to kick people. Having beliefs is necessary, they provide direction. Its as important as beliefs. Religion brings foundation to choice. |
Date: 5/5/2003 4:40:00 PM
From Authorid: 54444
Well at least you are being honest when you say you don't know, because honestly you don't. As far as I am concerned, intellectual honesty is worth far more than intellectual knowledge. so at least you are logging in on the right side of the ledger.  |
Date: 5/6/2003 7:00:00 AM
From Authorid: 61928
Well, Bill, I believe you're a fool, but that is far from a religion. Interesting that without knowing a thing about me, you know what I subsconsciously worship, but you seem pretty sure that you yourself are not subconsciously worshipping material things. I'm curious how you've managed to identify your subconscious motivations.  |
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Date: 5/6/2003 7:03:00 AM
From Authorid: 61928
These are the ramblings of a very confused person, Bill. "Beliefs. I love them you love them, Everybody has them. All people. Many. Loads, honest. Be they religious, or be they non religious beliefs. WE ALL HAVE BELIEFS. Many of us have them. ALL BELIEFS ARE RELIGIOuS. It matters not what they are. I beleive in crisps, therefore its sort of religious. In a way. Sort of. Maybe, I don't know. Perhaps I'm wrong. The point is. Beliefs are fantastic. Facntastic they are. If I believe there is no Rod Steward, thats just my belief. Its cool to have beliefs. They orientate, and you can't blame them. Thats because... I don't know why. Probably because they're so cool. I belive in God. No I don't. I vcan't work out whether he's real or not. pErhaps its psychological. I don't know, not sure. Lets figure it out. Work it out sorry. Er. Beliefs though, we need them. You can't not have a belief. Its imposible. Can't be true. Ridiculo. oh! Look. Its why we can never abolish religion. Because its our beliefs, which face us in the right direction. If we abolished beliefs, we be chocolate chip cookies doing a show because the ancient mesopatamians probably wanted the spaniels to grab t-junctions in Rome. I have a point" |
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Date: 5/6/2003 1:52:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 56927
No thought has been given to my things. We all have beliefs in plastic. Somehow, plastic is going to make our lives more fullfilled. I beleif I go against that thing. I know I'm full of it. It would be nice to have beleifs in the interest of the human rce. I believe in socks, thats good isn't it. What else. I beleive in cheese. Cheese saves life. Same as air. I had no part in the creation of air. |
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Date: 5/6/2003 2:03:00 PM
From Authorid: 24924
Helpful BILL, Go take a look out your window. Do you see some guys in white coats getting out of a white van marked "Sanatarium"? Be afraid.....be very afraid..... |
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Date: 5/6/2003 7:32:00 PM
From Authorid: 37872
Helpful Bill, I just don't think you get you're own points. |
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Date: 5/7/2003 1:33:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 56927
Religion is neceessary, ner, ner, ner. We need direction. Beliefs, no matter how strictly adhereed to foundation for humans to enter the future! |
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Date: 5/7/2003 2:08:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 56927
Religion itself is integral to the fitherment of the human race. If it is vaguely disciplined, we are faced correctly. Even those who suppose they are religionless have a set of beliefs which orientate. |
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Date: 5/7/2003 7:32:00 AM
From Authorid: 11240
"Let's figure it out. Work it out." These are the words of a very wise man. By understanding that humans can REASON and come to a realization in something that IS intrinsic takes dialogue, and to do that people need to cease stumbling over semantics, quoting others' ad nauseum, and insinuating re: the mental state of someone they simply don't understand. God Bless. |
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Date: 5/9/2003 10:47:00 PM
From Authorid: 37872
Helpful Bill, please define fitherment for me.... I am at a loss... Thank you. |
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Date: 5/10/2003 12:26:00 AM
From Authorid: 55967
Ra xaos, I think Bill meant "fishermen." Religion is integral to the fishermen of the human race. I'm not exactly sure why though. ~GypsyHawk~ |
Date: 5/10/2003 10:30:00 AM
From Authorid: 30647
Hello. I kinda agree with Slappy. ALthough the definition of religion is like...beliefs or something like that becuz we looked it up in English a couple weeks ago. But still, to say that any thing you believe is a religion is to play on words. In this society, religion means something different than beliefs, contrary to the dictionary definition.  |
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Date: 5/10/2003 8:07:00 PM
From Authorid: 37872
Thanks GypsyHawk, still at a loss though, lol... |
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Date: 5/11/2003 5:22:00 PM
From Authorid: 11240
To both Gypsy Hawk and Ra Xaos: Try "furtherment" which means "to further", which means "to promote/advance". God Bless. |
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Date: 5/11/2003 9:41:00 PM
From Authorid: 37872
Ahhh, thank you Deb |
Date: 7/2/2003 9:15:00 PM
From Authorid: 56840
I believe he is putting the bull's eye on the fact that if you don't make a choice, that's a choice in itself. Not necessarily the rhetoric of religion, but the principles, i think.. but who am I to wonder. and may I say something, The Thinker? I read in one of your comments that you said somethin about kids being a blank canvas. Hmm. I believe it is not the belief that has to be taught, but the experience that is to be gained. Children depend largely on adults, yes, but they also are not mindless in their decisions.. and also.. Even if someone grows up thinking that hurting someone means that they love that person, as soon as they experience the difference between what they experienced in the past and what they are experiencing now, the choice is one of survival. Maybe I am simply babbling.  |
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Date: 7/2/2003 9:18:00 PM
From Authorid: 56840
Aah, and another thing.. My beliefs are my bottom line, my life thinking that helps me make decisions. I think they might be the same thing. And if so, then it is OBVIOUS everyone has beliefs. |
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Date: 7/2/2003 9:37:00 PM
From Authorid: 12341
Not. Unfortunately, the followers of many religions believe that not only do they have access to a higher source of knowledge and morality than the rest of us, it is their duty to impose that knowledge and morality on us, apparently for our own good. Seeing no valid evidence that this knowledge has a Divine source, we recognise it as the product of humans from a time long past. We no longer need to be threatened with eternal torture or tempted by eternal bliss in order to form a civilised society.  |
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