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Date: 10/13/2005 7:53:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
Nope I didnt see it, plus I don't know a president that didn't have their stuff written for them, And I don't know a president that doesnt or did not beat around the bush, What did clinton say? I did NOT have sex with that girl? LOL I think all presidents including bush have their little things going on, and I do like bush but they ALL have their problems. Look at nixon and water gate, look at johnson, even kennedy in whom I really liked even tho I was only in fourth grade when he was president, had their stuff going on. Now I did see some news early today and it had a soldier that was in iraq and he said he was happy and couldn't wait to see about this next election because the Iraq people had did it all themselves, that THEY had control of this election on matters, not bush, not the american people. This was on fox news. But its good to vent as we all need to from time to time.  |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:00:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
I loved it when he said that the American People Are Behind Iraq when It came out Just Today that only 40% are supporting the war. And dont you find it Ironic that the day he gave the terrorism speech, that very night there was a supposed terror warning..and remember the days before this the karl rove story was tearing up the news. Bush is the most embaressing president we ever had.  |
Date: 10/13/2005 8:08:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
The whole written speech thing wasn’t a main focus point of my venting (yes, venting) but still, so we - the American people – should get use to being lied to? Concerning all the important issuers in our lives like gas, tax hikes, the war our tax dollars are funding, the bs patriot act that does not specify what a terrorist is (YOU can be a terrorist and they can take your home and put you in jail). We the American people are slowly but surely giving up our right. Look at the nonsense were force to live with now…high gas prices and everything else is getting higher. Im sure the upper class wont have any problems living but for everyone else, you figure it out. Someone said this…think it was Hitler…it want to control the people take away there rights and have them believe its for the best – something like that.  |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:10:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
Boom Boom I agree with you 100% buddy. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:12:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Does ‘The Great Deceiver’ ring a bell to anyone? |
Date: 10/13/2005 8:12:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Well, I guess that's your opinion...I don't choose to share it with you however. No offense but you don't seem very objective.  |
Date: 10/13/2005 8:13:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Thank you Psy  Matt aka |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:14:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
...As for the 40% approval ratings, everyone knows how reliable those are. They are taken along the same lines as the ones that said Kerry would win by a landslide, lol. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:17:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
You choose its all over the media not many people are supporting the war. And on foxnews its being reported 50% of Americans are now saying Iraq should of never been Invaded. And 100,000 anti-war protesters show up in washington, white only hundereds of pro-war people showed up. What does that say? |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:18:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Very objective? I think I’m objective to the point where I’m still labeled as a sane individual. My true beliefs on the other hand would label me as a nut as not everyone knows the story. No I don’t read conspiracy web sites I read facts…facts that no one seems to give a * about. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:19:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
And he still tied 9-11 to Iraq in his speech. Ahh when is he going to get it through his head that Iraq had nothing to do with 9-11? |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:20:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
LOL, tell me what government agency hasn't had their share of lies? I mean to grab one by the kahonies and not the rest isn't relalistic. I mean I could post or comment so many things about the rest of them, but why let this get to you so bad? Look at all the men and women killed during the vietnam war, which of course had nothing to do with bush or his daddy bush, but the other presidents. I mean was this right for them to continue in a war that went NO where? I dont think so , so to say bush is the worst, just isnt right. But then I dont know your age or how many presidents you have behind your belt. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:23:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
I'd like to see either of you two go through as much as he has without having a mental breakdown. First he delt with the voting fiasco, then 9-11, Iraq war(which by the way, MANY DEMOCRATS supported also), Hurrican Katrina, horrible forest fires out west...I mean COME ON, what gives? It's easy for many to like you (i.e. Clinton) since he delt with VERY FEW issues during his presidency and was only concerned with him own gratification obviously. It's so easy to ridicule and cut someone down when you're not in their shoes and can't even understand all they deal with in one day. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:26:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
this should've said...."It's easy for many people to like someone like Clinton, since he delt with VERY FEW issues and they were MINOR." During his presidency he was only concerned with his own gratification obviously but Bush gets all the ridicule because he's dealing with HUGE issues, (some that we've never seen before). It makes NO sense, sorry but it doesn't. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:27:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Mental breakdown? Its a fact that Bush is the only president to have taking the most number of days off...and hes got a nice tan to prove it. Hes a puppet...I wonder if he really does anything or if his administration tells him what to do...hes really a stupid human being. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:28:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Oh...let's not forget the creeping in of Mad Cow to the U.S. and now the possible Bird Flu. I don't know how he gets up each day after all this crap. |
Date: 10/13/2005 8:28:00 PM
From Authorid: 47296
Let's see, I have lived through ten presidents. How many of them lied at one time or another to the American people? All ten. It is called politics, and either you are savvy to the game, or you are taken in by it. Has Bush lied any more than any other president? No. You speak of troops being coached. Well, under Clinton, because I was still in the service, I was not allowed to state to another military member or the media my personal thoughts on the president. I was not allowed to call him a draft dodging, sex seeking, pot smoking, idiot. In fact, all military members were told they could not speak in a derogatory manner of the president to another military member or the media. Whether that order still stands today, I do not know. When Carter was president, we were not reprimanded for calling him what he was, a bumbling idiot. Under Reagan, we were allowed to speak our piece concerning his handling of military affairs, and the same under Daddy Bush. The fact is, there was little bad to be said about either one. If you want to get away from lies and betrayal, then I recommend finding a very secluded spot so far up in the mountains that no one ever comes around. As long as their is politicians, and as long as people are willing to beleive anthing they are told, regrdless of which party is doing it, then there is going to be some lies, and a lot of deciet.  |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:29:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Oh, he's stupid huh? I guess you have your degree from Harvard or Yale. I can't remember which but he graduated from one of them. You CAN'T be stupid and do that...sorry. As for days off...gee, he shouldn't take any I guess. He's only dealing with some of the worst issues of our time...lol. Where did you get that info anyway? I'd like some references please to back it up, otherwise it's GOSSIP. Thanks |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:30:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
You choose Bush is so imcompetant. What about all the lies on WMDS. He read a story about a pet goat while people were dying in the world trade centers. He has no withdrawl plan for Iraq, which any commander in chief would have. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:31:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
TS makes good points...I'm sure they all have lied on some issue. Of course, we don't have proof to say which ones in most cases. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:32:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
A pet goat story??? What are you talking about? He was sitting in an elementary school in front of a class reading to them. This was planned before the planes struck. So now he has to be PSYCHIC too...lol. Oh please. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:32:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
The conspiracy nut side of me wants to say the government probably manufactured the bird flue and mad cow disease…but its just a theory therefore no viable proof. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:32:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
And can i mention the month trip down to his ranch during August. Then He talks about WW2, while Katrina Striking the gulf coast. What leader is that? |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:33:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
AMEN TS |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:35:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
I did hear today that bush said he has NO plans until Iraq can take care of itself to pull out. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:35:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Psy...I think you need to get facts instead of gossip. Half of what you're mentioning makes no sense and is purely "talk" or things I've never heard about and I watch the news every day. WMDs...yah, old news. You might also want to mention that he was informed of this by our government's intelligence programs and that's why he came to that conclusion. You may also want to mention that other countries also thought the same...kind of important. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:35:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
You choose thats the book he was reading to the kids. His aide came up to him and told him what had happened, but kept on reading. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:36:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
You choose what other governments? I believe France, and most of Europe didnt fall for the WMDS. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:36:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Mad Cow and bird flu are conspiracies??? Umm...tell that to all the CONFIRMED and documented cases of deaths and family members on documentaries that have spoken about it. I'm sure they'll disagree with you. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:38:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Psy...so you're saying that the correct response from Bush would be to SCARE the entire elemetary class. I know that's the book he read...I stated that in my comment. I guess you feel he should've thrown down the book, jumped up screaming and ran out of the building crying. Umm...not. What would you do in that situation...please pretend that you can even understand or imagine the magnitude, awkwardness and historical elements of what he had to have been feeling at that second. I have doubts that ANYONE can. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:38:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Ya know, your all right but it doesn’t make it right. Politics is dirty by nature and I knew the outcome of this post before It was conceived because it all comes down to “that’s life”…but it doesn’t make it right…our government is the pieces that everyone else thinks it is…yea yea…if I don’t like it then move…doesn’t change that fact…like you guys said – it is what it is – I was trying to point out the significant lyes as to try to fathom ‘the bigger picture’ but I see no body wants to see the bigger picture…you live life accepting it is what it is at face value…well that’s not me, I want more…I want the truth…yea…I realize it will never change…probably. But that doesn’t mean I cant stop asking why. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:38:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
Your right youchoose, and just in the past few days they have found bunkers filled with the stuff to make bombs with. The thing is the president has many people that are suppose to tell him what the supposedly known facts are as Good lord the president cant be in ten places at once, and so he acted on not only what information he was given by these agencies, but even other countries that said the same thing, I mean come on, even KERRY agreed, until later, but then of course we know how many times kerry changed his mind, you would have thought kerry was a post-menstral woman. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:41:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
YC, concerning the bird flue and such - re-read that comment I wrote on it.... |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:41:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
No Psy...wrong, France refused to back us up cuz their scared about everything and everyone. They were also worried that we'd find out about the links they had to Saddam and the deals they made with him. As for the other countries that gave us the WMD assurance...Spain as I recall was one also. I'd have to search the web for the rest or find the hearing where it was stated. Colin Powell did list other countries along with the US though. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:41:00 PM
From Authorid: 47296
Boom, are you aware of how many days past presidents spent at Camp David, which is a preseidential retreat? During the Cold War, it was not uncommon for presidents to regurally fo there for a little rest and relaxation. Just because a president takes a little vacation does not mean they are not doing their job. they still have daily briefings, staff meetings, and handle important matters of state. It is a vacation in name only. I will say this much for Bush. He is done more to learn firsthand what the aftermath of Katrina and Rita were, and to find out what needs to be done in the effected areas. No president has ever spent the amount of time that he has in a disaster area. Did he have to go and see firsthand the devastation and talk one on one to the people? No. He can not be reelected, so there are no points to gain by it. He has done it because he is honestly concerned with the effects those storms have had on the people, and even more concerned about the government doing everything possible to help those in need to recover. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:42:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
Boom Boom Theres a new Merle Haggard Tune that I dont have the lyrics yet, But its called "Wheres Our Freedoms". Cant wait to post it here. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:42:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
Two Spirit heres a washington Post link...hes taken 49 trips http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/02/AR2005080201703.html |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:42:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
No boom ya cant stop asking and yes, it doesn't really matter the president as I wonder what other presidents would have done with so much thrown at them in what six short years? None of them were perfect and the ones to come won't be either, and yes we should ask questions, we should speak out but really other then to get it off our chest, what good does it do? And to psyguy, france, LOL, shoot they run and take cover in all circumstances, LOL. Why do ya think so many cafes changed the FRENCH fry to the american fry? LOL LOL |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:43:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
TS – if it wasn’t such a big deal why was the president’s vast amount of vacation days noted/brought up on the news? |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:44:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
The United Nations has determined that Saddam Hussein shipped weapons of mass destruction components as well as medium-range ballistic missiles before, during and after the U.S.-led war against Iraq in 2003. The UN Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission briefed the Security Council on new findings that could help trace the whereabouts of Saddam's missile and WMD program. The briefing contained satellite photographs that demonstrated the speed with which Saddam dismantled his missile and WMD sites before and during the war. Council members were shown photographs of a ballistic missile site outside Baghdad in May 2003, and then saw a satellite image of the same location in February 2004, in which facilities had disappeared. http://www.worldtribune.com/worldtribune/breaking_1.html |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:45:00 PM
From Authorid: 47296
Boom, if you seriously want change, then do like some of us have done and become active in politics. We are not talking about just getting out and voting. Try being an activist or lobbyist. Actually join a political party, attend meetings, and let your voice be heard within the party. Learn to talk one on one with politicians and elected officials. Even better, run for office yourself. You cannot make changes in politics by talking about it. You have to be active in politics to make changes happen. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:47:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
Bush Can Do No Wrong!!!!! Thats what everyone is saying |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:47:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
ya know the thing is the president even while on vacation HAS all his resources handy, its not like he is holed up somewhere and doesnt check in to see what is happening. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:47:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
FB, In the end it comes down to hearsay… |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:47:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
I hear you TS...thank you. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:49:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Checking in to see what’s happening as he is T-ing off (don’t know spell that) |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:49:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
I agree with FB and TS...good points made. Boom..."hear-say" goes both ways. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:50:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Pretty much Psy...when I say he knew beforehand about the events of 9/11 and the fact they denied it and then admitted to it…they say well S happends… |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:51:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Pointing fingers is easy...figuring out where the truth lays is harder and sometimes impossible. The only way to get the most objective view possible, is to listen to BOTH sides of the issue and do your homework through legitimate resources. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:51:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
No hon, not saying that bush can do no wrong, I for one did not appreciate the orders he gave after 911 and I'm sure many do not, as basically it says that even IF someone was to even LOOK like they were taking sides with the bin laden and his group, that they could be thrown into prison, based on just the military court. I did post about that a long time ago. No what Im saying is while yes bush does lots that many do not agree with, many other presidents did the same thing. Dont ya know were just pawns in this game called life? |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:52:00 PM
From Authorid: 47296
Psy, how many of those trips were business? Also, what business is it of yours, mine, or anyoone else's how many vacation days he takes? Boom, the media hits on stuff like vacation to try and play their hype. What they don't tell is everything that goes on during those vacations. They don't tell you what staff or cabinet members are coming and going. Having lived outside of DC myself, I can tell you that I would definitely want a vacation from that rat hole as often as I could get it, even if it were a working vacation. And Psy, as for your WMDs, talk to some of the chemical troops that were sent to Iraq. They will tell you they found not only the components to make WMDs, but the mobile vehicles to prepare them. In fact, four different vehicles were found at or near bases that housed weapon containers for chemical weapons. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:53:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Jeeze…im even hearing rap songs on the radio talking about Bush and all the bad things that they ‘believe him to be wrong of’. “Why Bush knock down the towers” – Jadakiss – why. Even songs concerning Katrina. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:54:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
Boom if your going to go into HE knew before 911 that it would happen, then you have to go into the rest of it. Many say that THERE was knowledge of this that was going to happen, heck even some say that the charges were set in the twin towers before the plane hit to make sure the building would go down and that the fbi and fema knew about it, and that they wanted this to happen. I mean there are so many people with so many theories. Its hard to know what to believe. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:55:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
Merle Haggard says and sings..."Yea, men in position but backing away/Freedom is stuck in reverse/Let's get out of Iraq and get back on the track/And let's rebuild America first." Haggard also comments on the current political and social scene in the song, "Where's All the Freedom?" He describes a country almost paralyzed by uncertainty, a nation where the Ten Commandments can't be displayed, where the grandparent of a soldier in Iraq can't afford to buy gasoline to drive to the grocery store, where individual rights are uncertain anymore. He concludes: "Are we a nation under God anymore/How long do we cower down/Is this really still our ground/Our country is like a prisoner of war/Where's all the freedom that we're fightin' for." |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:56:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
FB, you do realize the connection and finale roots Bush and the Bin Laden family have? Bush’s old oil company in texas was funded by Osoma’s brother. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:57:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
I choose not to go into the whole bombs in the towers, missile hitting the pentagon blah blah theories im talking about the pre-warning that they ignored…the facts. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:57:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Boom conspiracy theories are just that...theories, someone's opinions. Sometimes just down-right delusions. I'm not saying Bush is perfect but you know what, he's HUMAN as were all the other presidents who made mistakes. None of them were exempt from making mistakes. Of course you should consider the fact that it's easy to make FEW mistakes when there are FEW issues to deal with and not a lot of controversy surrounding those issues. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 8:59:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Psy...if you're getting you opinions from singers and celebs, I suggest you look elsewhere. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:00:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Boom....once again, where are your resources to back up your claims of his connections with Osama. Where is the PROOF? Without it, it's only your opinion. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:00:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
YC – I made it a point to not put any of my conspiracy theories into this article…what I stated is a fact concerning Bushes affiliation with…what a coincidence…the man that supposedly knocked down our great towers. It really makes me cherish the fact that my father took me up on the roof of one of the towers. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:00:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
These are two new songs from Merle Haggard. Like it or not, hes right. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:01:00 PM
From Authorid: 47296
Psy, if you read the words to the song that you just posted, you will see Haggard is not just criticizing our elected officials, he is also criticizing the people that want to take "God" out of people's lives, big business, and a lot of other things. Understand something about Haggard, like many other country singers, he sings song that relfect the attitude of the blue collar American. He may criticize elected officials today, then write a song a month from now praising them for something they did. If it sales, he, as well as others, will sing it. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:02:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Boom, there were no warnings stating that the towers would be hit. There were no written direct threats that said that NY was a target. There was a blanket memo that I believe was recieved during Clinton's presidency (not positive on that) that said Al Qaeda may attack again, referring to the Cole tragedy. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:03:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Trust me…its fact – it was mentioned in the news that Bush flew the Bin Laden family out of the country after 9/11 – Bin Laden was a CIA Operative, he had a codename and everything – the Al Qaeda terrorist that we are fighting – we trained them to fight the soviets – its fact – go look it up yourself. There are to many affiliations, All one big coincidence, no? |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:04:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Okay Boom, if it's a fact...show me the proof, the documentation from a legitimate resource? I've heard the theory, speculation on that and I'd like to see where Bush was buddies with Al Qaeda or Osama. I've never seen any UNDENIABLE proof. Without proof, it's a theory...plain and simple. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:06:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
You want me to look up something that you're claiming? Lol..umm, that's not how it works, no offense. If you say something is a fact, than you should have access to prove it is. That's how it works. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:06:00 PM
From Authorid: 47296
YC, there were indicators that Al Qada would strike, but none that indicated a strike on American soil. Overseas bases and ports were on a heighten security status, but at bases stateside, security was only upgraded one level, which meant it was pretty much business as normal, with only minor upgraded security precautions. The quickest way to tell if there is an immenent threat on American soil, is to look at the local military bases. If there are long lines to get on base, and military vehicles guarding the gate, rather than just the regular armed guards, then something is going on. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:06:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
WASHINGTON, Sept. 29 — In the first days after the terror attacks on New York and Washington, Saudi Arabia supervised the urgent evacuation of 24 members of Osama bin Laden's extended family from the United States, fearing that they might be subjected to violence. In his first interview since the attacks, Saudi Ambassador Bandar bin Sultan, also said that private planes carrying the kingdom's deputy defense minister and the governor of Mecca, both members of the royal family, were grounded and initially caught up in the F.B.I. dragnet. Both planes, one jumbo jet carrying 100 family members, and the other 40, were eventually allowed to leave when airports reopened and passports were checked. Mr. bin Laden is estranged from his family. One of his two brothers in the United States called the Saudi Embassy frantically looking for protection, the ambassador said. The brother was sent to a room in the Watergate Hotel and told not to open the door. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:08:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
You Choose Remember the First World Trade Center Attack back in 1993? |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:08:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
As far as Bush flying Bin Laden's family out of the country after 9-11...maybe it was distant relatives that feared for their lives due to affiliation or having his name. If that's the case, since they had nothing to do with 9-11 and were probably cleared from conspiracy...I'd say that's a very humane thing to do. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:09:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
Heres some stuff off cnn Khalid Shaikh Mohammed, the mastermind of the plot, planned to have nine of the planes crash into the FBI and CIA headquarters, the Pentagon and the White House, as well as nuclear plants and the tallest buildings in California and Washington state. Mohammed was arrested in March 2003 in Pakistan and turned over to U.S. authorities. The hijackers of the 10th plane, which Mohammed planned to pilot, would contact the media, kill all of the adult men onboard and then make a statement denouncing the United States before freeing the women and children. The plot also called for hijacking and blowing up 12 airliners in Southeast Asia, but al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden scrapped that part of the plan because it was too difficult to coordinate operations on two continents. Bin Laden scaled back the plot in the United States to the four planes that were eventually used in the attack. They narrowed down the list of targets to the World Trade Center towers, the Pentagon and either the White House or the Capitol. Bin Laden wanted to hit the White House, but Mohammed and Mohamed Atta, the leader of the 19 hijackers, favored the Capitol, because they felt it would be an easier target. Mohammed initially proposed the attacks in 1996, but planning did not begin until 1999. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:10:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
Look you choose look at the years 1996, 1999. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:10:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Thanks for the clarification TS. Since you are so knowledgable on historical events and I have seen that from you on this site...I know you've done your homework. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:12:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Psy...so why is only Bush to blame, he was only in office for 9mos when 9-11 happened? Why aren't any of the other government officials prepared and why didn't they pass down the severity of this possibility? Most likely because NO ONE ever believed something like this was possible and no one could have or did predict it. Bush was simply a victim of circumstance. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:12:00 PM
From Authorid: 47296
Yes, Bin Laden did work with others in Afghanistan to try and remove the Soviet invasion, and yes, they did recieve support from the CIA. In fact, many of the Taliban were given support not onyl by the CIA, but other neighboring countries that were worried of the Soviet threat. Bin Laden may have in fact been a CIA operative during the late 70s and 80s. As with any trained attack dog though, it is easy for one to turn on it's master. Just look at Noriega. Also, when you speak of the bin Laden family, it is quite a big family, and it's money comes from construction work in the Middle East and other areas. Osama basically walked away from his family, and even considers some of them as evil, since some family members are still willing to do business with the US. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:14:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
It's funny how Clinton once again holds no responsibility for any of this even though he was in office during the years you mentioned. That is making me laugh, sorry but it is. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:17:00 PM
From Authorid: 63026
Bin Laden During The Clinton Years Warn America to withdrawl its troops from Saudia Arabia, and the Middle East or face the wrath. We Payed for it. We werent attack for our Freedoms, We were attacked cuz we were on their holy land. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:20:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
TS....that's interesting. I did hear about how in the past there were dealings with Osama because they previously didn't consider him a threat but he was a ally. "Trained attack dog" is right and how unfortunate for us and those he hates. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:21:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
After seven years of deceit, deception and delay, Cohen said, Iraq cannot be trusted. "The world agrees that Saddam must fully comply with these inspections" by the U.N. Special Commission "or else" he faces the severest consequences, Cohen said. http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/library/news/iraq/1998/98031702_ppo.html BOOM, yes I've heard that one before and if ya look really close you will see that bush apparently has to do with the illuminate as well as his supposedly being involved in the one world order and many things, but I've looked on the web and good lord what president isnt with those things? |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:23:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
TS...another thing you mentioned about the enormity of the Bin Laden family rings true and how terrible it was be for those he's disowned and disgraced. His neice from NY was on an interview a few months ago crying, saying how she's harrassed and tormented because of her name. She hasn't seen Osama or her dad in more than 15 yrs but is paying for his terror. I felt so sorry for her and to make matters worse she is a person with a memorable look and is noticed everywhere she goes. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:23:00 PM
From Authorid: 47296
If anyone wants to throw blame for 9-11, then go back as far a the Reagan presidency. Because of Iran-Contra, and a few other deals in the Middle East, there was a major shake up at CIA, which resulted in only a few intelligences sources on the ground in the Middle East. Also, in Afghanistan, where Osama and company based most of their major operations, there was little if any effective intelligence, because of the Taliban. There had been no significant intell in the region since before the first Gulf War. We also had few intell sources in Pakistan, which neighbors Afghanistan, because of our dislike of the Pakistani-India nuclear weapons race. A look at any map will show that Afghanistan was for the most part cut off from any significant intelligence, which allowed Al Qada to operate unhindered. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:28:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
FB, I agree...Saddam's number was up years ago. He should've been taken care of the first time but that's just my opinion. He constantly ignored sanctions and pushed the line, like the time he shot at our planes as we were flying over open air space. I'm very happy he's gone...although justice will probably only be done once he's dead. Sad but true. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:30:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
TS...excellent point. We lacked a "proactive approach" on Al Qaeda for decades. It's pathetic that our intell was so inadequate for so long. |
Date: 10/13/2005 9:30:00 PM
From Authorid: 63194
Yes i agree that the polls are un reliable. i highly doubt that Even 40 percent agree with the war... its probably much much less.  |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:35:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
the poles were referring to his "approval rating." As for those that disaprove of the war, since that has fallen SO much....they agreed in the beginning but not now. You either back up a war and support it's cause or you don't. I also wish we could pull-out of Iraq now but then again...I don't know all of the political and issues that the president and the administration does. I also want our soldiers to come home but I also realize that we have to finish what we've started or we look like a bunch of whimps. We need to be sure that the Iraq soldiers can hold their own and I pray to God that that time is coming VERY SOON. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:35:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
Youchoose I just wonder when they are going to do something with him. Well ya''ll this has been interesting but I've got to get some sleep, going out of town for two days, I'll be here in the morning to check the post and IF our trip is not for a day or two then I'll come back to respond. Good night for now. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:39:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
I do too FB (about Saddam that is). Good luck on your trip, have a good night. :O) |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:55:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
As to my lack of reply - my room is currently flooded as is my family room (right outside my door) so im gonna be soaking up water the rest of the night. Just wanted to say thanks for your input guys, night. Matt aka |
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Date: 10/13/2005 9:55:00 PM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Thanks Jersey Grrr... |
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Date: 10/13/2005 10:01:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Wow, I'm sorry to hear about the flooding. What happened? I hope things get better soon...good luck. |
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Date: 10/13/2005 10:01:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
Good night all.... |
Date: 10/13/2005 10:02:00 PM
From Authorid: 55967
You Choose, way back up the post, you forgot to mention another thing Bush had to deal with RIGHT after getting into office. The awkward incident in China when a spy plane was shot down. Back then, I was wondering how this new president was going to handle this one. He proved to have some political mettle there. Aside from that, I have to say you, TS, and FB have all said exactly what I would have said and more.  |
Date: 10/13/2005 10:37:00 PM
From Authorid: 62383
Bush doesnt have a lot of skills. Girls want bf's with skills. lol  |
Date: 10/14/2005 12:48:00 AM
From Authorid: 45630
The fact of the matter is this, no politician in the world will answer straight forwardly, they will confuse the issue so that if something does go wrong you are bewildered as to what they said in the first place.  |
Date: 10/14/2005 1:12:00 AM
From Authorid: 62267
Bush and Kerry both suck...either way it went we got the shaft...It looks like they'd actually try to get someone in office who was actually decent...I can't stand that rat faced thing.  |
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Date: 10/14/2005 1:12:00 AM
From Authorid: 62267
CLINTON ALL THE WAY!!!! |
Date: 10/14/2005 2:10:00 AM
From Authorid: 62915
I think the problem with Bush is he does a bad job of covering up his lies and makes it way too obvious that he reads off cue cards  |
Date: 10/14/2005 2:52:00 AM
From Authorid: 12084
The presidents who beats around the bush.... huh... let me think for a minute! OK... this is what I think! Every president has at one time or the other, beat around the bush. And now the "BUSH" has become the president. And the Bush (aka George) has become an expert, and worthy of being the grand daddy of knowing all the tricks of all former presidents who beat around the bush. He thinks he is so hot, at what he is doing, that he has surpassed the first burning Bush, (aka George)and that he has become One like unto the burning Bush which Moses saw. Thats kinda what I think.  |
Date: 10/14/2005 3:42:00 AM
From Authorid: 14464
I don't like listening to Bush because I get very irritated by the way he speaks. It takes atleast an hour to get one sentence out.  |
Date: 10/14/2005 4:17:00 AM
From Authorid: 30986
Soldiers can never say what they truly feel and think because they have a commanding officer to face after they get off air and they can and do make your life miserable if you don't conform to what is considered the norm.  |
Date: 10/14/2005 7:20:00 AM
From Authorid: 62849
I think that every president takes office with a plan in his head- and the plans might just be as one-tracked as possible. Yeah, it seems Bush has had to deal with a lot more than Clinton, but think about it- his interest in the world is focused differently than Clinton's was. Focus can make all the difference. -Beags  |
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Date: 10/14/2005 8:27:00 AM
From Authorid: 16671
Thanks GypseyHawk. Kysta is right, if soldiers want to get ahead they will say what is PC. Boom sorry you got flooded. |
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Date: 10/14/2005 8:30:00 AM
From Authorid: 16671
psyguy about the story for the kids, what was bush to do, disipoint the kids by not finishing, or telling them about the horrible thing that happened? nanananannananan I love to mess with your mind. LOL, J/k my friend |
Date: 10/14/2005 9:46:00 AM
From Authorid: 11240
To respond to the original post, CNBC (I think, it's usually the only channel hubby has on during the day) showed the pre-question set-up whereby the troops were given tips (take a breath before you speak) and the subject matter of their questions. The world's a stage and everyone is a player, is all I have to say about the rest of this discussion. God Bless.  |
Date: 10/14/2005 11:17:00 AM
From Authorid: 820
Although I find political debate absolutely pointless, I can't help but have a strong opposition to Bush, our goverment, and the direction he has led our country. I was really dissapointed in America when he was re-elected. I figured we'd all learn from having him in for four years already that he was detrimental to our country.  |
Date: 10/14/2005 11:47:00 AM
From Authorid: 13119
If you know anything at all about the military you would realise that they have a PAFFO and that PAFFO tells us what is appropriate to divulge and what isn't. It makes sense.  |
Date: 10/14/2005 11:54:00 AM
From Authorid: 53284
Your statement on Bush helping the bin laudins leave the US is factually incorrect. That was portrayed as fact in Roger Moores movie. In reality, the bin laudins chartered a jet and left the US on the first day that planes were allowed to fly again. There is no evidence that they had any clearence or special considerations. Bush did not have anything to do with chartering the jet or arranging for them to leave. If you watch roger moore movie, moore trys to make a connection where there isn't one.  |
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Date: 10/14/2005 12:19:00 PM
From Authorid: 13119
Micheal Moore |
Date: 10/14/2005 1:32:00 PM
From Authorid: 63080
I saw it and it made me ill!!!  |
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Date: 10/14/2005 1:34:00 PM
From Authorid: 53284
Woops! I didn't mean 007 I meant M Moore. Too many moores to keep straight. |
Date: 10/14/2005 1:59:00 PM
From Authorid: 25390
"Notice when Bush gives his speeches, which he’s clearly reading word for word." You forgot to add, "which nearly every other president has done for years and years."  |
Date: 10/14/2005 2:43:00 PM
From Authorid: 52155
Few things we all need to realize here- #1- When the first plane hit the World Trade Center, almost no one thought it was on purpose. So when Bush was told about it, why should he automatically assume that it was any more than an accident. And as such, what could he possibly do to help anything? Does he fly into or hold a national press conference over every plane that crashes?  |
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Date: 10/14/2005 2:48:00 PM
From Authorid: 52155
as for vacation time, I couldn't find any current figures, but as of 2003, W had taken 250 days off for vacation during his 3 years in office (less than 70 days a year,) compared to the the average American getting over 110 days off a year. By comparison, Clinton was a workhorse by taking less vacation time of anyone since Carter, but with the enormous responsibility these guys have, I say let them take care of themselves sometimes. |
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Date: 10/14/2005 2:51:00 PM
From Authorid: 52155
In regards to Katrina- It was not Bush's job to mobolize anyone or anythign after the hurricane hit. It was the local governments responsibility. Notice how BEFORE Rita hit both Fla and TX's governors had already called their National Guard's into action? LA's governor waited til after Katrina hit to activate their Guard. Slow moving by the local gov't cause many of the issues that the area faced after the hurricane. Not Bush's fault, nor responsibility. |
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Date: 10/14/2005 2:52:00 PM
From Authorid: 52155
Two Spirit and YouChoose make some mighty excellent points in here. |
Date: 10/14/2005 5:30:00 PM
From Authorid: 15228
http://278medic.blogspot.com/2005/10/speaking-with-president-bush.html  |
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Date: 10/14/2005 6:43:00 PM
From Authorid: 24924
Two Spirit Quote: "there were indicators that Al Qada would strike, but none that indicated a strike on American soil..." Yeah, and that is what Condi Rice said under testimony about the the Aug 6, 2001 PDB that Rice claimed had "only historical information and no specific Al Qaeda threats". As you can see here there WAS much more than just that; much references to US soil attacks being planned:  |
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Date: 10/14/2005 6:44:00 PM
From Authorid: 24924
(Al-Qaida threat included in Bush memo) By JOHN SOLOMON ASSOCIATED PRESS WRITER............. WASHINGTON -- President Bush's August 2001 briefing on terrorism threats, described largely as a historical document, included information from three months earlier that al-Qaida was trying to send operatives into the United States for an explosives attack, according to several people who have seen the memo. The so-called presidential daily briefing, or PDB, delivered to Bush on Aug. 6, 2001 - a month before the Sept. 11 attacks - said there were various reports that Osama bin Laden had wanted to strike inside the United States as early as 1997 and continuing into the spring of 2001, the sources told The Associated Press. The same month as that briefing of Bush, U.S. intelligence officials received two uncorroborated reports suggesting terrorists might use airplanes, including one that suggested al-Qaida operatives were considering flying a plane into a U.S. embassy, current and former government officials said. [...] The sources who read the presidential memo would only speak on condition of anonymity because the White House has not yet declassified the highly sensitive document, entitled "Bin Laden Determined to Strike Inside the United States."[...] The sources said the presidential memo included a series of bullet items that brought Bush through a history of mostly uncorroborated intelligence that cited al-Qaida's interest in hijacking planes to win the release of Islamic extremists who had been arrested in 1998 and 1999 as well as the trips of suspected al-Qaida operatives, including some U.S. citizens, in and out of the United States. It suggested al-Qaida might have a support system in place on U.S. soil, the sources said. The document also included FBI analytical judgments that some al-Qaida activities were consistent with preparation for airline hijackings or other types of attacks, some members of the commission looking into the Sept. 11 attacks said earlier this week. The second-to-last bullet told the president that there were numerous - at least 70 - terror-related investigations under way by the FBI in 2001 involving matters or people on U.S. soil, the sources said. [...] The sources said the briefing memo did not provide the exact date of that intelligence but made clear it was in the 2001 time frame, and that FBI and other agencies were investigating it. The information had been provided to intelligence and law enforcement agencies well before Bush's briefing, the sources said. They said final bullet in the presidential memo was based on an intelligence report received in May 2001 that indicated bin Laden operatives were trying to cross from Canada into the United States for an attack. |
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Date: 10/14/2005 6:57:00 PM
From Authorid: 15228
Yesterday, I was chosen to be among a small group of soldiers assigned to the 42ID’s Task Force Liberty that would speak to President Bush, our Commander-in-Chief. The interview went well, but I would like to respond to what most of the mass-media has dubbed as, “A Staged Event.” First of all, we were told that we would be speaking with the President of the United States, our Commander-in-Chief, President Bush, so I believe that it would have been totally irresponsible for us NOT to prepare some ideas, facts or comments that we wanted to share with the President. We were given an idea as to what topics he may discuss with us, but it’s the President of the United States; He will choose which way his conversation with us may go. We practiced passing the microphone around to one another, so we wouldn’t choke someone on live TV. We had an idea as to who we thought should answer what types of questions, unless President Bush called on one of us specifically....read the whole thing as they say at the link provided above...this is no different than what they do in tv interviews with reporters. |
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Date: 10/14/2005 8:28:00 PM
From Authorid: 47296
Catherine, there were some indications of a possible attack on American soil back as early as the first Gulf War, and continuing through much of the 90s. Many bases stateside had gone to Condition Bravo (upgraded security procedures), and remained at that condition, or a modifcation thereof, since 1990. There were no specific indicators as to any particular target, and nothing to lead the military or government intelligence agencies to beleive any attack was imminent on American soil, up to the morning of the 9-11 attacks. A search of notices to travellers abroad up through 9-11 will show the places that were considered to be a signifcant threat of probable attack, and they were all in either the Middle East, North Africa, or Southeast Europe. There is one thing that many people do not realize, and that is that the United States prior to 9-11 was one of the easiest countries for terrorists to operate in. Even after security measures were put in place post 9-11, we still remain an easy country to operate in. There are hundreds of miles of shorline that have no security, and many places along both the Canadian and Mexican borders where a person can walk across unchecked. Once in the country, a person can drive coast to coast without ever being stopped once. Targets of opportunity are numerous, and most are never guarded. I could name over 100 targets right now that would do more damage and cause more deaths than all four attacks during 9-11 combined. Fortunately though, at present, no terrorist have even attempted to hit those targets. There targets have all been selected to make a point. If terrorists ever decide to bring wholsale terrorism to our shores, then the only thing that will ever stop them is strict martial law, and a total suspension of our Constitution, two things that no president ever wants to be remembered as doing. Understand this, terrorist will strike on American soil again, and there is absolutely nothing we can do to stop it. It could be tomorrow, next year, or five years from now. They have the advantage. They do not have some set schedule they have to operate by, their options as far as targets is numerous, and even though we all witnessed the events of 9-11, the American people still do not know how to counter terrorism. When we least expect it and our guard is down, they will hit again. |
Date: 10/14/2005 8:56:00 PM
From Authorid: 63191
This seems to be a conversation between just a few people, so I'll say this and be gone. I think President Bush has done a great job, he's the first President I've had any use for in my 47 years, and no matter what people's opinions are, I voted for him...TWICE...and I like the man. Enough said. USMOM  |
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Date: 10/18/2005 8:58:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
YUP two spirits they will hit again. |
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Date: 10/20/2005 5:55:00 PM
From Authorid: 34487
I second that USMOM.... :O) |
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