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Date: 7/23/2002 8:11:00 AM
From Authorid: 11528
No I do not put any creedance into the doomsday scenario of the bible. I believe it was a cleverly written book meant to create guilt and fear thereby controlling the thoughts and actions of those succeptible to the message. It creates a seperation amongst the population which in turn causes many problems and strife which the controllers capitilise from in many ways. One only has to look back at history to see the harm done from this Jewish myth, and all of it with no proof other than what was written on paper. Bye for now. Enki  |
Date: 7/23/2002 8:11:00 AM
From Authorid: 56042
I believe there isn't a "judgment day" b/c some people die b/c others killed them and some die b/c of disease... The people who kill would be sent to "hell" will the victum will be forgiven of all there sins right...wrong what about the person who is sick would they be sent to "heaven" or "hell" b/c maybe before the became ill they did something sinful, but died b/c they were sick... Everyone no matter how little of a sin it is you would still be sent to "hell" then brought back to "heaven" after you stay in "hell" for awhile b/c that's how you get the sin out of you... that's the story that was told to me... I believe that when you die your soul just follows the people you love around to keep them safe... DeziA  |
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Date: 7/23/2002 8:28:00 AM
From Authorid: 16671
God has forgiven us, if ONE chooses NOT to accept that Jesus paid the price for our sins and believe what God has to say, then yes, those that do believe what God says, Does go to heaven and NO the others do not. This is called making the choice. You have made your choice so when "that day" comes, why whine about it? I mean, gee, if the Christian is wrong and the rest of you are right, if there is no heaven , no hell, why worry about it? God doesnt make someone born to kill. Your leaving out the element of the god of this world satan. yes, I believe the day is coming. However you have alot of issues here and it would take six posts to explain it all. You should stick to one topic at a time.  |
Date: 7/23/2002 8:31:00 AM
From Authorid: 15621
Ill say one thing....You ask why God does not forgive all?...He does if they ask!...and yes, the day is coming when all will stand before him and must then account for what they have done, whether or not they have accepted  |
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Date: 7/23/2002 8:33:00 AM
From Authorid: 15621
Now, as far as Debate goes...this cannot be debated.....the most obvious reason is that you nor I nor anyone else knows the mind of God, secondly, Are Gays born that way?....Do people who are mentally retarted get punished in the afterlife for crimes acted upon against others?....I would think not but, Im not God so?..I dont know...All we can do with what you have presented is speculate |
Date: 7/23/2002 8:36:00 AM
From Authorid: 13546
I never believed that the day was coming my way, at anytime. How could we just stop and say such a thing as that, for how do we really know when that "judgement" day is going to occur (I don't think it will) . I am in the same boat as you Boom Boom, with trying to ponder and understand these things, without everyone coming up with these complex answers that do not help me in the slightest way. If God is all forgiving, then wouldn't that mean that there would be no judgment day? Because then everyone would be forgiven not matter what, and goto heaven, because they have been forgiven for the sins that have occured? Ah.. another one of those things that I do not understand.. hopefully I will be able to read upon many different views in this post. :  |
Date: 7/23/2002 8:39:00 AM
From Authorid: 24924
Um, yeah right; this God must coerce his followers to worship him by threatening punishment in the eternal damnation of HELL. We are TOLD; we are preached too, that we have "free will", but if we choose against him, we are punished forever. THAT IS NOT A CHOICE!!! This vicious bully who gets mad at his little toys and takes vengence on them......*grins*. I just can't stop thinking about all of the torment we have had to suffer throughout the centuries, until God totally forgives us for the fall of Adam & Eve and ends it? *wink* (Oh, yeah.....what was that about ABSOLUTE POWER corrupting absolutely?).   |
Date: 7/23/2002 8:51:00 AM
From Authorid: 19092
Mans inability to understand God is not reason enough for me to change my belief or position. I've found my truth, had things revealed to me for what ever reason, and made "my" choice. As have you...now, we live the best we can within the teachings of our beliefs and await our fate...  |
Date: 7/23/2002 8:51:00 AM
From Authorid: 54830
I hope not, and it wouldnt be during our life time, besides i dont believe in "God" because im a femminist, i wish the would start with a Goddess, and then well talk... GigaBitez  |
Date: 7/23/2002 9:03:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Firstborn – There is a specific strand of DND that is link to many murderer and many defense attorneys try and use this to try and get their clients off or a lesser sentence. I doubt that it works because murder is murder. God created us from birth with – un touched by negative energies and Satan. This linking DNA is in our body since birth. People are born to kill – “Natural born killers”. Yea I know I have many issue in here and this isn’t even all of them. This is what I have been thinking about for such a long time and I just needed to get it all out. Thank you for your comment Firstborn  |
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Date: 7/23/2002 9:14:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Six Guns – So I can go on a killing spree and stop by the local church and ask for forgiveness and *bam* I’m in heaven. Does he forgive you based on what you have done or based on you mental state and the reasons behind it? People do have mental illnesses that don’t know right from wrong and can/do go and take a life. This can be debated on the knowledge the bible has presented us – the Ten Commandants – the scriptures – it can be debated based on the obvious ~ Person has a mental imperfection and kills someone, is it right for him to go hell because he was born – from birth – with a mental handicap that lead him to his current situation – Yes/No. What you can do with what I presented is read it and place it against the word of god – does it make sense? Is it contradictory? Would a just god do this? Thanks for the comment Six Guns |
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Date: 7/23/2002 9:19:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Thank you Rainbow, exactly where I’m coming from. I am looking more for understanding of ‘why’. Thanks for stopping in Carissa |
| Date: 7/23/2002 9:22:00 AM From Authorid: 55376 Sorry, your DNA evidence is only evidence of predisposition, not predetermination. People are not born to kill. Og |
Date: 7/23/2002 9:23:00 AM
From Authorid: 33925
Yes I do still believe that Judgement day is coming..God states clearly that if we ASK for forgiveness we shall be forgiven..How can he forgive you if you do not ask?? I wish people would stop and realise that God is not some horrible person who sits on his thrown rubbing his hands together just waiting for us to screw up so we can bow down to him..He is a loving and compassionate God and he weeps at our imperfections...IMO  |
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Date: 7/23/2002 9:28:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
That’s right Thinker. Free will is preached but if you don’t go along with gods ways then you get eternal damnation…comforting thought coming from people that preach free will. It is fact that good things can come from bad. You may not see it but it does in the strangest ways. So are all bad things from Satan or God? A store gets robed – all the money looted, no one gets hurt. Store beefs up security and potentially stops what could be a future life threatening robbery. You get into drugs heavily – Bad ~ you recover and now you help other individuals stop using drugs or get off – Good from bad. 911 for example – horrible event. But now the US is going after terrorism to stop future attacks and prevent more casualties. |
Date: 7/23/2002 9:31:00 AM
From Authorid: 31837
Well, actually. Even sinners go to heaven. Even athiests.  |
Date: 7/23/2002 9:34:00 AM
From Authorid: 14254
I personally don't think there will be a "judgement day", per se. I believe more in Karma, an on-going process where whatever evil is done by you is returned to you, and so is good. Just my opinion on the matter.  |
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Date: 7/23/2002 9:35:00 AM
From Authorid: 31837
I didn't mean to say my reply so 'factual'. it is the conclusion I have come to after much research and meditation. |
| Date: 7/23/2002 9:37:00 AM From Authorid: 55376 Well if God wants people to go to hell, that is his choice. Og |
| Date: 7/23/2002 9:40:00 AM From Authorid: 55376 God, just practices tough love. Og |
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Date: 7/23/2002 9:43:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Og, it possibly could be predetermination if they did DNA test on every person when they are born and check their criminal records and run a DNA test. It seems that the people that researched this concept had enough evidence to come to this conclusion and find a common DNA strand in the murderers. I think the strand even had a name. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 9:46:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
I understand where you’re coming from T-dub. I have my own concept that I believe in very much of heaven and who goes and what its like. |
| Date: 7/23/2002 9:47:00 AM From Authorid: 55376 That is wrong.There is no single strand of DNA that is common to all murderers, unless it is in common with the total population. Please reveal your sources. Og |
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Date: 7/23/2002 9:49:00 AM
From Authorid: 40089
Yes this Day will surely come and us goin thru this earth age has nothing to do with the fall of Adam & Eve . God Bless  |
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Date: 7/23/2002 9:50:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Lady Luck, I understand where you coming from. I am just asking the questions of life. It’s about time someone does. You can’t lead a blind faith. If I choose to follow god (like I did) I wouldn’t ask these questions. I think a true follower in god questions god and his ways. Even Mosses questioned god. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 9:55:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Og, its something we learned in law class. A German scientist Hans Burner (I forget the spelling of the last name) is responsible for the discovery of this strand. Og, I've been looking for something to show online (trying to remember the right spelling of his last name), when I find something I will let you know. They even showed us videotape |
| Date: 7/23/2002 10:12:00 AM From Authorid: 55376 I too have read evidence in the pass linking DNA strands with violent crime. I believe this evidence shows predisposition, not predetermination. In order to show predetermination you would have to show this strand exists EXCLUSIVELY in murderers. Og |
Date: 7/23/2002 10:22:00 AM
From Authorid: 51173
This is a bogus arguement against free will and God's judgement. Boom Boom, as a lawyer in training, you should know better, my friend. Change the focus a bit and the falacy is easily exposed - there is a standard of behavior (the LAW) that states "When the light turns Red, you will bring your car to a complete stop." I can CHOOSE to ignore that law and speed through the intersection when the light is red, or I can choose to obey that law and stop the car. If I disobey that law and run the light, I get a TRAFFIC TICKET, or ARRESTED, or BOTH. If I obey the law, something good happens - NOTHING! No ticket, no jail time, and my insurance premiums go down when I renue my policy. But it was my choice as to breaking that law, and I knew what the penalties would be if I chose to break that law. There is no one to blame but myself if I have to pay State Farm more money after I pay my ticket and get released from the P-Farm." ----- This is the EXACT same arguement that God makes about salvation. There is a standard set (accepting Jesus as your Savior), and YOU can chose to do so or not. You have been told what will happen if you choose to accept Him, and you have been told what to expect if you choose NOT to accept Him. But it IS YOUR CHOICE. Tom  |
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Date: 7/23/2002 10:31:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Og, I am looking for something on it. It was the few papers I kept as I found it an interesting topic. If I cant find anything on the topic then so be it, I don’t base my whole post solely on that example. Thanks for the comment |
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Date: 7/23/2002 10:39:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Hiya Tom, I think you are commenting on my comment to Thinkers comment. The post is more about who gets to be saved – does god pick favorites – forgiveness – etc. Not directly about free will. Like I said to Six Guns – can I kill someone and sincerely ask for forgiveness and then I am in heaven. What if I went into a temporary state of insanity and I wasn’t in a normal state of mind and sinned – would I still go to heaven - does that take away the fact that I sinned or took someone’s life. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 10:40:00 AM
From Authorid: 14254
Hi, Tom. There is a bit of a problem with your anaology. First of all, this is not an attack... sheerly my opinion. According to Christianity, it all boils down to whether or not you accept Jesus, right? Good works mean nothing. Therefore, breaking laws and rules mean nothing...it all comes down to acceptance. Doesn't, in that case, Christianity negate true and just judgement? Think about it. If Joe Blow lives a long, good life as a Hindu, doing morally all those things he is supposed to for the betterment of humanity...then none of his works will be rewarded on judgement day because he didn't believe in Jesus. He won't even technically get a trial. The whole of "judgemnet day" will be "who believed, who didn't", not a judgement according to works. To me, this sounds terribly wrong. I think this is Christianity's major flaw. The only people who will recieve a just judgement will be Christians...everyone else gets thrown into hell for a thought crime. I like Judaism's rendition of God much better...deed, not creed. It is what you do that saves or condemns you. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 10:45:00 AM ( From Author )
From Authorid: 26733
Blue Moon Tom, this isn’t an attack at all. |
| Date: 7/23/2002 10:51:00 AM From Authorid: 55376 Actually,Blue Moon, Christianity is divided on works vs. faith. Protestants tend to argue for faith alone (though not all). Catholics usually argue both are required. Og |
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Date: 7/23/2002 10:52:00 AM
From Authorid: 14254
Very true, Og. The whole "Calvinist vs. Wesleyan" thing. I know that battle well. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 10:54:00 AM
From Authorid: 14254
It's amazing how a million different denominations can get a million different interpretations out of a single book. The "inerrancy" issue may need to be explored. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 10:58:00 AM
From Authorid: 15621
Tom, I see exactly where your coming from, when I read The Thinkers response I thought, "Wait a Minute, there is no choice if Punishment is involved"? ...You said it very well, just because you get punished for doing it one way and get no punishment for the other does not mean its still nto a choice. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 10:59:00 AM
From Authorid: 15621
Blue moon, I dont think Tom meant that as a literal statement....He meant it in regards to Salvation...not works. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 11:01:00 AM
From Authorid: 14254
Thanks for the clarification, Six Gun. However, my point still stands. |
| Date: 7/23/2002 11:03:00 AM From Authorid: 55376 My interpretation of God's love from reading the Bible is that God's love is more like that of a jealous spouse than a parent. Og |
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Date: 7/23/2002 11:11:00 AM
From Authorid: 57452
~Ack! Good post, certaintly makes one think. I am going to go debate with my roommate! *she laughs* •Have a good Tuesday.• ~Ms. HollowLuna  |
Date: 7/23/2002 11:12:00 AM
From Authorid: 53500
Aside from throwing out Bible verses that show that it is unbelief in God, NOT sin that sends one to hell, and that God doesn't play favorites I'll just say this about your disbelief in the Day of Judgement. For your sake, I hope you're right.  |
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Date: 7/23/2002 11:18:00 AM
From Authorid: 15621
Og, as far as the relationship between God and the hebrews I agree....God often reffered to the hebrews lawlesness as spiritual adultry. But, as Christians we are Saved through Christ and are the Children of God. Now, look at some of the things that went on as a whole and tell me any Parent OR spouse would not have done the same taking this into consideration........Israel was his "spiritual ?????" whatever yo uwant to call it, spouse, children...whatever.......But, they were this as a Whole...as a WHOLE......did he punish them by death as a WHOLE?...NO....I hope Im getting my point across, when your children mis-behave do you punish them?......People say God is not loving, let me tel lyou all something.....the hebrews were given miracle after miracle and turned there backs on God time after time, (spiritual adultry), worshipping other Gods after all that was done in a time when they KNEW GOD EXISTED....YET....HE TOOK THEM BACK..time after time and will again in the final days, all ISrael the bible says shall be saved........How many of you can say you would stay with your spouse after they left you, turned away from you to live with another, committed adultry on you, and did not return....would yo uwait the rest of your life for them?......would you love them with all your heart?......Hell No......God does! |
Date: 7/23/2002 11:39:00 AM
From Authorid: 51979
Yes the day is coming. God does not pick favorites. All have a chnace at God's love. You can kill, and accept Christ, all sins are the same to God. Every single person on Earth has the chance to accept Jesus, and if they don't, they had there chance. Born to kill...are you kidding me?  |
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Date: 7/23/2002 11:46:00 AM
From Authorid: 51979
The thinker, God wants a relationship with you so much He sent His son, which was God as a human, ONE OF US, to die for us, to endure the most painful death the romans had, and then He still gets spited by people like you. Yes adam and eve screwed it up for us, but He made it all better, He re-opened the link bewtween man and God, you just have to take it. God does not scare us into believing by hell, not me at least. It's His love, His unlimited love, that brings me to a relationship with Him. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 12:03:00 PM
From Authorid: 51173
Boom Boom, As to the idea that God may play favorites, John 3:16 should answer that question: "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that WHOSOEVER believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." - your issue of repentance is a much tougher issue but yes, IF what you feel is GENUINE repentance. If Hitler, at the last moment in life suddenly said "Oh, crap! What have I done! Jesus please forgive me for the evil I have done!" AND MEANT IT (that is the key), yes God would have forgiven him. But a person who says "God forgive me for killing someone." - but who'se motive for saying that is fear of punishment, there is real reason to question if God will forgive them. Their motive is the key. Also, just because God forgives us of the eternal aspects of our sins, doesn't mean we are excused of our Earthly responsibility for those sinful actions. This kinda brings me to my reply to Blue Moon - IF Jesus is accepted as your Savior, and the Holy Spirit of God takes up residency in you, surely their would be some kind of demonstratable change in behavior - not perfect behavior perhaps, certainly not at first anyways, but some kind of change in attitude that would be reflected in the WORKS we do. Romans 7 and 8 are perhaps the best explanation of the relationship between works and faith. Your works are the fruit that shows how your faith is growing. As to those who have never heard of Jesus Acts 17:30 says: "And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:" ----- those who have never heard the Good News are judged by a different standard than those who have. Peace, Tom |
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Date: 7/23/2002 12:17:00 PM
From Authorid: 14254
I respect your point of view, Tom, though I disagree with that system of theology. Peace, |
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Date: 7/23/2002 12:22:00 PM
From Authorid: 51173
Fair answer, Blue Moon, Peace to you as well, Tom |
Date: 7/23/2002 1:36:00 PM
From Authorid: 23610
I definitely do not believe in a "judgement day". That would be silly. To think that we only live once and that thereafter we sit in limbo awaiting someday, maybe thousands of years down the line, to be judged and then placed in one of two places to spend the rest of eternity doing basically nothing, makes no sense to me. We create our own interpretation of God and on this earth we have created several different religions to embody those interpretations....but they are of our own making, as is the term sin (another manmade concept used to control others). Personally, I believe in reincarnation. To me it makes more sense to have more than one life to experience and grow from. One life would be like attending first grade and expecting to graduate from College after it. The only judgement is the one we make of ourselves in what we learned and how we treated others. I do not believe there is a Supreme Being sitting there waiting to cast into an imaginary hell.  |
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Date: 7/23/2002 1:57:00 PM
From Authorid: 24924
Vital, YOU do not know me. You do NOT know my heart; and you do not consider the possibility that I have spent as many hours (maybe more) examining certain specific claims made by Christians as you have spent examining the entire religion. Could it be that I have thoroughly investigated it all so that I know precisely what it would take to change my mind on the question? I have heard the Christian arguments; I have seen it, did it; done, tried it, and NOW KNOW that none of it makes any sense to the intelligent, THINKING person, ME, who sees absolutely NO REASON TO BELIEVE. Until you or anyone else can provide that; I shall stand by the truth. I choose the truth over a comfortable MYTH, any day. My mind is open, and my eyes are open, so if anyone wants to try to convince me that Santa Claus exists and it is required by rules of logic to bring forth strong and convincing argument for such beliefs; by all means, have a go at it, otherwise don't go around saying things like you're "spiteing" or (as one hypocrite said to me the other day) "You've built an icy wall around your heart", and other such statements, when you don't have a clue as to what my life is and all about. No thanks, to your religion. I'd rather follow TRUTH whereever it may lead at whatever cost. That may not win friends and influence people at a Church Potluck, but it is a system of ethics that I can live with; I can go to sleep at night and I can wake up and look myself in the mirror and know that I am doing the best with what I've got. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 3:35:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
Boom: yes and they use to say that tomatoes was posin and would kill you if you ate one. I dont know about this dna strand your talking about, I've not read up on it. I'm not saying that its false as I dont know. I'm just saying that men do use lots of things to prove their point. Kind of like the glove didnt fit O>J> type of thing. Your welcome , but the best thing I have found is that when someone has issues like this and wants to find out what God would do, read about him. He gives us the answers. Thinker: You have told us on here that You were a Christian for many many years. IF that is so, then apparently you did not know anything about God during those years, and just went for the social setting as everyone knows its not God telling us make the choice or burn. Everyone knows that after man turned this world over to satan when adam and eve sinned that NOW its satans, man seperated us from God, NOT God seperating himself from us. HE wants us back, HE made the way. ITs not a choice of choose me or your going to die and go to hell, its the choice of your going to die and go to hell anyway, BUT i've made a way out for you. ITS called free will and by MANS free will, the first man, adam, GAVE away out spiritual destiny with God. GAVE it AWAY. So see this is where many make the mistake, they believe that God is sending them to hell, NOT so. YOU send yourself for not taking a FREE gift of salvation. |
Date: 7/23/2002 3:46:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
BlueMoon, In answer to your question about works. And about doing wrong things thinking hey its ok, going to heaven anyway, it really doesnt work that way. AS if one has truely accepted Jesus in his heart, he/she will strive not to murder, steal, be mean to people and by that I mean help them if they are hungry, or need a place to hang their head, ect. Now, I know lots of christians are going to argue with me on this point here, BUT there is also a scriputre that tells us:""Rom :11: For there is no respect of persons with God.Rom :12: For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;Rom :13: (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.Rom :14: For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:Rom :15: Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another Rom :16: In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel."" However I do believe this applies only to those that will never hear the name of Jesus or the gospel of Jesus Christ. NOW many may HEAR the name of JESUS, heck, I heard it off and on all my life. BUT I was NEVER told the gospel of Jesus until I was 35, didnt know what it meant, and unless a person KNOWS for sure What it is, what they are rejecting, then I believe the other scriputre will apply to them. As God is a just God. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 5:09:00 PM
From Authorid: 24924
awwww, Deb, come on; Ye Olde "You never were a Christian" thingy is old and boring. Makes me sickingly disgusted, how theists have cliche's and pat answers and replies for everything; and the exclusivist....'Us versus Them' mindset. Always and ever the "Na na na na na...I'm special; I can see God; I'm on the inside...etc. and You're not. Na na na na na". "Free Gift of salvation". Preach to the choir, Deb; Preach to the choir. *and to just think...I USED to believe such things* * Scratches head* |
Date: 7/23/2002 5:10:00 PM
From Authorid: 10146
IF,more people could only see and understand, that the Angels before the Foundation of the World was ever Placed, Were devided into Two Groups by "THEIR" CHOICE, at "THAT" time. When they all sang (as the Stars of heaven and the sons of God)together as gods (Little g's) with the Supreme Creator GOD of them. IF.., More People could only come to know this, and also Know that When the Earth was Created they "ALL" throughout the History of Mankind did become, (and has)Became "ONE" with Earth. At the time apointed only By "GOD", When Each one upon Human Conception became Incarnated into Earth. Then you would see that One Group was Redeemed, By JESUS CHRIST OUR SUPREME CREATOR. While the Lesser group in "NUMBER", is forever Destined for eternal damnation. If more, truly more..., OH my FATHER in Jesus name, could recieve this Understanding by the Power and Knowledge of Christ Jesus. Then "SO", SO MANY of these QUESTIONS these men have asked, would become so vividly clear in Spirit! What do people think, Who Believe in the Bible, when John 17:12 records JESUS the son of "MAN Saying to HIS INNER BEING in REVERENCE, THOSE that thou Gave Me I HAVE KEPT, and "NONE" of them is "LOST"? What ones, do they believe was Kept and will never be lost?  |
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Date: 7/23/2002 5:22:00 PM
From Authorid: 10146
Your bodys of Flesh, have you (the Angels) the ones that number with the Holy Two Thirds, so Blinded, that many of you, can only see from Mankinds perspective, And all mankind can reflect, is sin and confusion. However, "ONE MAN" THE GOD that Created Man and Became a Man, has DELIVERED EACH AND EVERY ONE of you. If you dont know, Who you are, HE DOES. And NO ANGEL, or NO MAN, is he unjust with, Based on the Choices WE each made, as we Stood, both by, and With Him, before the Foundaition of the WORLD, was ever Placed. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 5:56:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
AND YES, I'm going on time out again, I have things to do. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 5:56:00 PM
From Authorid: 16671
See thinker, I didnt say YOU never were a christian, dont put words in my mouth, I said, apparently you did not know anything about God for all the time you spent in church. So stop the Martyr act. If you knew WHEN you were Christian the Word of God you know then that your lying when you say::God must coerce his followers to worship him by threatening punishment in the eternal damnation of HELL. We are TOLD; we are preached too, that we have "free will", but if we choose against him, we are punished forever. THAT IS NOT A CHOICE!!!" BECAUSE that is NOT how Chrisitaians few it or tell it. So its either you went to church and learned nothing, or your lying about these things you spout, cant have it both ways. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 7:41:00 PM
From Authorid: 51979
Thinker, does the worlds truth really make sense to you? Come now, I think you are an intelligent man, well then how can something come of nothing? Don't give me the cushy response, "Well where did God come from?" seriously. The only thing that makes sense to me is that some supreme bieng made the universe. It's too hard for me to imagine anything none intelligent creating something so well contrusted. I do not know you, no, tell me what the truth is...the truth you side with, tell me what it is. And all my religion has to give to you is love, so stop stereotyping all christians, because YOU DO NOT KNOW ME. All I know of you is that you are still a sinner without repentance. But it seems to me that you've been preached out alot, a whole lot. It's good you have an open mind, but how do you know what was written in history, all of it, is authentic...? This so why rule the bible out? It all makes sense to me. And I am sorry to have made you mad. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 8:35:00 PM
From Authorid: 23610
Wow, Vital Death, watch out. In sitting there accusing other's of being a sinner are you not in danger of "sinning" yourself for pretending to be able to judge another's heart and intentions? Personally, I do not believe in sin....as I know it is a man-made concept invented to cause others to feel guilty and control them (such as you are attempting to do now).....but if I did believe in sin....I would say "Can we say the word 'hypocrite'". Oh....and as another example of how you must not know Thinker.....well....she is a she....not a he. At least get to know a person before you judge them a "sinner". Even Jesus didn't do that. Christians do still believe in Jesus, don't they? |
| Date: 7/23/2002 8:40:00 PM From Authorid: 55376 Reincarnation is a man-made concept also. Og |
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Date: 7/23/2002 8:55:00 PM
From Authorid: 23610
Og, the truth is what concept that we can conceive is not man-made? So you are correct that reincarnation is a man-made concept. What one has to ask themself is since we cannot prove these interpretations that we believe in....can we then use them to condemn or curse another for their lack of conformity to the interpretation? |
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Date: 7/23/2002 9:07:00 PM
From Authorid: 51979
i can only laugh at myself after reading your reply to me Lady Nyx. I am sinner, but a cleansed one. I mean...I never said I wasn't a sinner, I am only saying that I am cleansed in Christ...I sin but am forgiven. And yes, but what are genders on USM? They don't really matter to me ^_^, but I am a sinner, as you are, and as we all are. I am just saying I am saved, and as far as I know she is not...thats all I know about her. Sorry for bieng hypocrital. Sinning is a part of life, we are born into it, we are all sinner...errr...seems I dug myself I nice hole. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 9:09:00 PM
From Authorid: 51979
Re-reading my comment I was hypocritical. Ahhhh...sorry Thinker. I was not trying to use sin to control Thinker....I was just saying the only thing I know about her was that she was not saved, but that would have no meaning to her, bieng she doesn't beleive in people bieng saved...could the author just delete that comment...lol...sorry thinker. |
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Date: 7/23/2002 9:40:00 PM
From Authorid: 23610
Hey, well, at least you have a sense of humor, Vital Death. I can appreciate that. |
| Date: 7/24/2002 11:13:00 AM From Authorid: 55376 Yes, we can condemn someone based on our beliefs. it is called free speech.You know the 1st Amendment. Og |
Date: 7/26/2002 11:28:00 AM
From Authorid: 51070
I don't believe in judgement day. If God really is all mighty and powerful, and just loves us so much, then why would he want us to die some horrible death? I don't know what to think about this.  |
Date: 8/15/2002 8:44:00 PM
From Authorid: 43586
heh, nice post, well, all i can say is there is a plan out there somewhere, we are not born sinless, we are born SINNERS, dont you know that?  |
Date: 10/24/2002 1:11:00 PM
From Authorid: 52736
you are such a deep person. i like what you have to say here about the church. sometimes religion needs critism; especially the "all-knowing" Catholic Church. i have a lot of problems with religion, but i think you've hit on one very essential one....all of the contradictions that can be found in even a very minimal skimming of the Bible. i have written so many poems about religion, and i agree with your stance on it. ohhh and btw, you write wonderful poetry lol yeah i just had to get that in...peace love and tangerines, a fellow poet  |
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